Cant get my Medical Certificae because of ignorant doctor!

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twill0420

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Twill0420
Went and did my ME and got defered because of my hand amputation. I wear a fully functional prostethic and can control it! I cant even start my lessons for my private pilot license without my medical certificate. Due to the FAA being a government office and the government being shut down I havent been able to talk to anyone to move the process forward. The last time I talked to anyone at the FAA the representitive said i would need a SODA before my first flight. I cant even take lessons until i get my medical certificate!!!!! I heard of a doctor named Bruce that is understanding and certifys peoples with prostetics!!! Can anyone help me or give me some advice.
 
Ryanb said:
Well technically you CAN start lessons without the medical, you just can’t solo. That is, unless, the flight school has some weird stipulation that prevents it.
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They do prevent and stop you from training and working your way towards your hours needed for private pilot license. There was an incident in the past where a few people got all the way to the solo and couldnt get their medical exam. They took legal action to get the funds spent on lessons back! So i cant even fly with and instructor until i have my medical certificate! All of the schools within a five hour radius are the same!!
 
twill0420 said:
They do prevent and stop you from training and working your way towards your hours needed for private pilot license. There was an incident in the past where a few people got all the way to the solo and couldnt get their medical exam. They took legal action to get the funds spent on lessons back! So i cant even fly with and instructor until i have my medical certificate! All of the schools within a five hour radius are the same!!
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I would guess this is the policy of the school you are training at, correct? Because nothing that I can recall from the FAA regulations prevents you from training with a willing instructor and completing any checkboxes that are non-solo items. Including those items that are traditionally post solo, like the Dual Cross Country and Dual Night activities.

If that is the school's policy, bummer. Would it put you in hot water to find an instructor outside of that school who will take you on while you deal with the medical certification issues?

twill0420 said:
All of the schools within a five hour radius are the same!!
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While that might take all of the "organized" flight schools out of the picture.... have you looked into finding an independent instructor who is not directly affiliated with one of the schools? Get to digging in the local aviation community (including the local and regional Facebook pages/groups) and I bet you can find one. Perhaps share your physical location and someone on PoA can provide a lead or two.


Also, as Matthew indicated, you can get busy on the written exam and knock that one out of the park.
 
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twill0420 said:
I heard of a doctor named Bruce that is understanding and certifys peoples with prostetics!!! Can anyone help me or give me some advice.
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You are likely thinking of Dr. Bruce Chien of Bolingbrook, IL. He is a member here under the username of @bbchien.

And yes, he is a very understanding fellow and willing to do a lot for his airmen as long as they are humble and honest with him and will follow his direction without whining about the difficulty of the process or trying to find an angle around the rules/regs.

The best way to get going with him is to send him a message through his How To Start webpage.


Yeah, it sucks to be one of the folks caught up on the wrong side of the government shutdown and I feel your frustration. Hopefully once these political issues are dealt with and FSDO is back to full open, you can get an appointment with the right inspector and get that SODA done.
 
AggieMike88 said:
I would guess this is the policy of the school you are training at, correct? Because nothing that I can recall from the FAA regulations prevents you from training with a willing instructor and completing any checkboxes that are non-solo items. Including those items that are traditionally post solo, like the Dual Cross Country and Dual Night activities.

If that is the school's policy, bummer. Would it put you in hot water to find an instructor outside of that school who will take you on while you deal with the medical certification issues?



While that might take all of the "organized" flight schools out of the picture.... have you looked into finding an independent instructor who is not directly affiliated with one of the schools? Get to digging in the local aviation community (including the local and regional Facebook pages/groups) and I bet you can find one. Perhaps share your physical location and someone on PoA can provide a lead or two.


Also, as Matthew indicated, you can get busy on the written exam and knock that one out of the park.
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I live in baton Rouge,LA and i will start to look and reach out to people.
 
Matthew said:
If you can’t find an instructor willing to train you while wait, might as well get the written test out of the way.
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I’d be pretty darn sure he can get a medical before doing anything else...
 
twill0420 said:
All of the schools within a five hour radius are the same!!
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First off, I'm pretty sure you haven't talked to all the flight schools in a five hour radius (why in the world would you??), so you might cut back on the dramatics. You're going to need to keep a cool head under pressure if you want to be a good pilot. Keeping a cool head as you deal with this situation will be good practice.

Next, if your medical situation requires interaction with the FAA to get your certificate, and the FAA folks you need to work with are on furlough, then it doesn't matter how much doctor-shopping you do right now: All of them are going to have to wait for the FAA to re-open before they get get your medical through. That may be lousy, but there's nothing you or Dr. Chien or anyone else can do about it until the gov't reopens.
 
Jim_R said:
First off, I'm pretty sure you haven't talked to all the flight schools in a five hour radius (why in the world would you??), so you might cut back on the dramatics. You're going to need to keep a cool head under pressure if you want to be a good pilot. Keeping a cool head as you deal with this situation will be good practice.

Next, if your medical situation requires interaction with the FAA to get your certificate, and the FAA folks you need to work with are on furlough, then it doesn't matter how much doctor-shopping you do right now: All of them are going to have to wait for the FAA to re-open before they get get your medical through. That may be lousy, but there's nothing you or Dr. Chien or anyone else can do about it until the gov't reopens.
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I literally googled it and called everyone that came up its not that hard. I will take your advice on keeping a cool head. I just dont see the need to prove myself if people with my same physical condition have proven their self capable of flying.

Im playing the wait game now it sucks! It only mounts the frustration and anxiety because i cant do anything.
 
bbchien said:
Your “ignorant doctor” did it correctly. FAA will create a certificate “valid for flight test purposes only”. Then you will get to show an inspector that you can do it.....
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How so? Maybe im just misunderstanding the process and I’m ignorant! Thats not what they said. The representative on the phone basically said I will get my certificate once I preform my solo flight with an FAA representative. How can I do a solo flight if i can’t train and learn to fly? As stated previously in my earlier post I cant even start my first lesson in flight school until i have a medical certificate. The doctor could have issued me a temporary one until i got ready for my solo. It could have given me one with restrictions on it (i.e. flying only with a licensed pilot or certified instructor!
 
twill0420 said:
I just dont see the need to prove myself if people with my same physical condition have proven their self capable of flying.
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"Have proven themselves capable of flying" is the operable phrase.

And how do you think they accomplished that?
  1. Their AME followed the protocol of deferring the medical application to OKC
  2. The reviewers in OKC looked at the submission, found it to meet the standards for the listed deficiency, and sent the airmen a medical certificate with the limitation of "Valid for flight test purposes only".
  3. The airmen took that to the local FSDO, scheduled his SODA flight, did it, passed, and obtained his "normal" medical.
As in they followed the proper procedure. Your situation does not sound any different, so demanding you be treated differently isn't going to work.
___________________________

Look, I get that you're frustrated that the government shutdown has created a cramp in your desired timeline. You need to get over that. And as we have suggested above, (1) direct your energy toward the knowledge test, and (2) do what's needed to be more than ready to move forward once the shutdown is over.
 
twill0420 said:
How so? Maybe im just misunderstanding the process and I’m ignorant! Thats not what they said. The representative on the phone basically said I will get my certificate once I preform my solo flight with an FAA representative. How can I do a solo flight if i can’t train and learn to fly? As stated previously in my earlier post I cant even start my first lesson in flight school until i have a medical certificate. The doctor could have issued me a temporary one until i got ready for my solo. It could have given me one with restrictions on it (i.e. flying only with a licensed pilot or certified instructor!
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You do realize you are replying to the same "Bruce" you asked about in Post #1? and that he is the same Dr. Bruce Chien I mentioned in Post #6?

And what about "...and will follow his direction without whining about the difficulty of the process or trying to find an angle around the rules/regs" do you not understand?


Take a breath. Calm down. Try to learn about what the proper process needs to be before you go running off half cocked.
 
twill0420 said:
The representative on the phone basically said I will get my certificate once I preform my solo flight with an FAA representative
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By the way, it won't be a solo flight. "With an FAA representative" means they will be in the airplane with you.

So you are not alone, nor solo.

My guess that, as a very early student, the flight might have the FSDO inspector handling take off and landing, but once in the air, he will ask you to perform some simple maneuvers and control manipulation. Maybe change the frequency on the radio. All the while observing how well you can perform these tasks.

If he feels that you are capable of doing these tasks adequately and nothing is a "safety of flight" problem, then he will update your paperwork appropriately and send you on your way.
 
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twill0420 said:
Went and did my ME and got defered because of my hand amputation. I wear a fully functional prostethic and can control it! I cant even start my lessons for my private pilot license without my medical certificate. Due to the FAA being a government office and the government being shut down I havent been able to talk to anyone to move the process forward. The last time I talked to anyone at the FAA the representitive said i would need a SODA before my first flight. I cant even take lessons until i get my medical certificate!!!!! I heard of a doctor named Bruce that is understanding and certifys peoples with prostetics!!! Can anyone help me or give me some advice.
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You should be able to legally take flight instruction but I assume the school isn't allowing it. It took me around 78 days to get a SODA, from the time we sent the initial request in to being issued. The government shutdown would have probably stopped it dead tho.

Send request to OKC
OKC sent me a letter back advising I was authorized to take a medical flight valuation and to schedule it with the FSDO of my choice.
Called the FSDO and schedule the flight. Rented an airplane for that day.
Flew with the FSDO on a bitter cold ass day for about an hour and all went well.
SODA issued on the spot.
Everything went smooth, but the FSDO is located on my home base as well as the rental airplane.

NOTE: I was a certificated private pilot before getting amputated but I don't see how the process would be much different.
 
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twill0420 said:
I just dont see the need to prove myself if people with my same physical condition have proven their self capable of flying.
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The FAA has procedures.
Procedures are followed. No matter what.
The fact that other people with any particular condition got a medical is irrelevant. The procedure says...
bbchien said:
Your “ignorant doctor” did it correctly. FAA will create a certificate “valid for flight test purposes only”. Then you will get to show an inspector that you can do it.....
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(Dr. Chien is one of the most knowledgeable individuals on this planet when it comes to what the FAA will and will not do)

The FAA does not care how long you have to wait. They don't car how much you want to fly. They don't care if you are the next Bob Hoover. They care about following procedures. That's just the way it is.
 
Welcome to aviation, if you are unable to wait and do it right, then you may not be cut out for it. Relax.
 
The flight school has an ignorant policy. I guarantee you that it is unique among their competitors.

At the least, call a few and explain your situation.
 
I'm finding it hard to believe a school would refuse good money to train someone.
 
twill0420 said:
I literally googled it and called everyone that came up its not that hard. I will take your advice on keeping a cool head. I just dont see the need to prove myself if people with my same physical condition have proven their self capable of flying.
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So among the dozens of places you called you talked to KUSA and Flying Tigers, and that's what they told you? I seriously doubt it.

I live within five hours of Baton Rouge. I began my flight instruction before I got my student medical. I soloed a little later than I probably could have due to scheduling issues in getting my student medical. It can be done, and it can be done within 5 hours of you.
SkyHog said:
The flight school has an ignorant policy. I guarantee you that it is unique among their competitors.

At the least, call a few and explain your situation.
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But he has already called every single flight school within a five hour radius and all of them have the same policy!!!!!!
 
Salty said:
I'm finding it hard to believe a school would refuse good money to train someone.
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Yep; it would be easy enough to tell them that they'll need a medical to solo, and the school cannot guarantee that you'll get one.
 
Ryanb said:
Well technically you CAN start lessons without the medical, you just can’t solo. That is, unless, the flight school has some weird stipulation that prevents it.
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While this is not the situation, a VA student must have the approriate medical for the certificate they are seeking.
 
Clip4 said:
While this is not the situation, a VA student must have the approriate medical for the certificate they are seeking.
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You mean if they want the VA to pay for it. But I’m pretty sure VA does not pay for PPl in any situation.
 
twill0420 said:
Went and did my ME and got defered because of my hand amputation. I wear a fully functional prostethic and can control it! I cant even start my lessons for my private pilot license without my medical certificate. Due to the FAA being a government office and the government being shut down I havent been able to talk to anyone to move the process forward. The last time I talked to anyone at the FAA the representitive said i would need a SODA before my first flight. I cant even take lessons until i get my medical certificate!!!!! I heard of a doctor named Bruce that is understanding and certifys peoples with prostetics!!! Can anyone help me or give me some advice.
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It's not like that at all. You were required to have the SODA at your appointment. That is, you were required to have been tested by an approved facility and have the SODA document issued to you. Lacking that, the AME was required to defer your medical. The doctor is not the ignorant one here. YOU are the owner of your medical, not the AME. You are responsible for compliance.

Now you're into the medical deferral process. Once the FAA gets around to your medical, you'll get a letter in the mail that instructs you what to do. That letter will have strict deadlines on it. Adhere to everything the letter says and you'll get your medical. If you don't adhere, you will get a denial.

As far as this guy named Bruce - Dr Chien does not suffer fools. Stop acting like one and take responsibility for yourself. Otherwise you honestly have no business being in command of an airplane.
 
twill0420 said:
They do prevent and stop you from training and working your way towards your hours needed for private pilot license. There was an incident in the past where a few people got all the way to the solo and couldnt get their medical exam. They took legal action to get the funds spent on lessons back! So i cant even fly with and instructor until i have my medical certificate! All of the schools within a five hour radius are the same!!
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I call BS. First I have hard time believing you have tracked down and spoken to every single flight school manager and every single freelance CFI within a five hour radius. Second I simply cannot believe that given the tight margins in flight instructing, there is not a single school within five hours that is willing to take your money in exchange for some dual instruction.
 
http://www.maxpreps.com/news/3RIPUV...ck-anglin-wins-big-with-no-hands,-no-feet.htm You can find him in the public FAA database.

This guy earned a medical certificate. It was a long journey but we got it. Video everything you can.

Sit down, take a deep breath, take training through solo sign off. Get the ride with the inspector. As a prior poster said, if you don't have the patience for that, then indeed you cannot have enough patience to become a pilot. If Zach could do it so can you. You simply have to have the patience and perseverance. And you have to demonstrate that.

Insulting your "ignorant" doctor will get you no help on this planet.

I will also take credit for bnt83 having a certificate. He wrote a book about it in which I am pleased to have a passing mention. So buckle it down!
 
Next time you see the doc, you might ask him to help relieve your major case of butthurt. Just be sure to tell him how ignorant you think he is first.
 
Juliet Hotel said:
I call BS. First I have hard time believing you have tracked down and spoken to every single flight school manager and every single freelance CFI within a five hour radius. Second I simply cannot believe that given the tight margins in flight instructing, there is not a single school within five hours that is willing to take your money in exchange for some dual instruction.
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I can’t believe anyone would be willing to drive 10 hours round trip for a flight lesson.
 
Clip4 said:
I can’t believe anyone would be willing to drive 10 hours round trip for a flight lesson.
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No idea where the OP lives, but people in Elko, NV have to drive a long way for some things. It's about equal distance to Reno, Boise and Salt Lake... about 4 hours one way. In the lower 48, Elko is probably the largest city furthest from a trauma center.
 
As I was once instructed,patients is a virtue,as the military would say hurry up and wait. Slamming a medical professional on social media ,is never a good thing.
 
bbchien said:
http://www.maxpreps.com/news/3RIPUV...ck-anglin-wins-big-with-no-hands,-no-feet.htm You can find him in the public FAA database.

This guy earned a medical certificate. It was a long journey but we got it. Video everything you can.

Sit down, take a deep breath, take training through solo sign off. Get the ride with the inspector. As a prior poster said, if you don't have the patience for that, then indeed you cannot have enough patience to become a pilot. If Zach could do it so can you. You simply have to have the patience and perseverance. And you have to demonstrate that.

Insulting your "ignorant" doctor will get you no help on this planet.

I will also take credit for bnt83 having a certificate. He wrote a book about it in which I am pleased to have a passing mention. So buckle it down!
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Update 3-11-19
The FAA no longer issues medical certificates for “student purposes only”. I have raised my status to priority airmen by calling so much. The government shut down slowed things up but since reopening i have not had things move a whole lot faster. The FAA sent a letter saying i needed a letter from my orthopedic doctor stating my limitations if any. I provided the letter and I am waiting on the FAA to get back with me. They are trying to schedule a flight test. My deliema is i cant fly. I only have about an hour in the air. How can i test when i cant get someone to train me because i dont have a medical certificate? I have taken a deep breath and buckled down as this has been a roller coaster ride with no end in sight thus far. Im prepared for the ride and I’m sticking it out.
 
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