Can you learn to fly on a F33A?

Jessica Palmer

Jessica Palmer

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Jpalmer77
Husband bought a Bonanaza F33A. He’s been flying for 30 years. I want to learn to fly at some point myself.. could I learn to fly on a Bonanza or will it be too much?

Note: I have not asked hubby to teach me.. I’d rather find out if I should just start on a 152 or 172 before I bring the subject up. He’s a CFI II so he could be my instructor but he doesn’t know I’m interested in learning yet.
 
The useful answer is yes, but it will take longer. How much longer is open to debate and subject to variations in students.

insurance will probably go up but no idea how much.

that said, training in the plane you intend to fly is good. Primacy will be established with your plane.
 
Jessica,

Ideally, no. Your husband's Bonanza, while an excellent aircraft, is not a good primary trainer. It is a high performance, complex airplane. In flight training we like to do things in stages - crawl before we walk, walk before we run. Most student pilots learn in an airplane like the one you described rather than an F33. It will make for a more enjoyable experience with less frustration and a higher margin of safety. If I had to hazard a bet as to whether your husband will agree when you discuss it with him, I'd put my money on his agreement with those thoughts.
 
Ryan F. said:
Jessica,

Ideally, no. Your husband's Bonanza, while an excellent aircraft, is not a good primary trainer. It is a high performance, complex airplane. In flight training we like to do things in stages - crawl before we walk, walk before we run. Most student pilots learn in an airplane like the one you described rather than an F33. It will make for a more enjoyable experience with less frustration and a higher margin of safety. If I had to hazard a bet as to whether your husband will agree when you discuss it with him, I'd put my money on his agreement with those thoughts.
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That’s the answer I was looking for.. thanks!
 
Please understand that I asked this question here because I wanted an honest answer. Straight out asking him could be awkward, especially if the answer was “no”. I wanted a heads up so I could express interest in learning at the local flight school if the Bonanza was a bad aircraft to begin flying with.
 
Take flight training at the local flight school in secret and after you get your certificate ask your husband to teach you in the F33.... Won't he be surprised at how fast you learn. ;)
 
Zeldman said:
Take flight training at the local flight school in secret and after you get your certificate ask your husband to teach you in the F33.... Won't he be surprised at how fast you learn. ;)
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Lol! Wouldn’t he though? I could probably sneak away a few hours a day. Thank you for your advice.
 
eman1200 said:
would be better to learn to fly IN a F33.
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Not too many folks agree with that notion though. I’m a very laid back person and I don’t want to put any pressure on the husband for something I could learn elsewhere and then train on the F33 later. I figure at this point I’ll bang up a 152 or 172, get my solo or license.. then approach him on learning the f33.. ‍♀️
 
Jessica Palmer said:
Not too many folks agree with that notion though. I’m a very laid back person and I don’t want to put any pressure on the husband for something I could learn elsewhere and then train on the F33 later. I figure at this point I’ll bang up a 152 or 172, get my solo or license.. then approach him on learning the f33.. ‍♀️
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I was just busting your chops about the title of the thread :)
 
medium_image_1497868_1_1591473082.jpeg

Pick up a T-Craft , get your certificate in a tail wheel. Keep it or sell it after getting your PPL. You will have a blast
 
Bill said:
Your husband is a CFII and you’re asking these things here????
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Jessica Palmer said:
Before I mention it to him, yes..
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So you're worried he won't be a CFII after you mention it to him? :D

But a little more seriously, I take it that the Bonanza purchase was recent so a couple questions would be: What was he flying before that? Did you fly with him much and were you pick up anything via osmosis? Things like being comfortable on the radio, knowing the sight-picture and knowing what to expect during certain phases of flight can get you a leg up. At the very least, you can gain a bit of insight being in the right seat of the Bonanza while you beat up on the flight school's 152/172/Warrior learning how to land.
 
AKBill said:
medium_image_1497868_1_1591473082.jpeg

Pick up a T-Craft , get your certificate in a tail wheel. Keep it or sell it after getting your PPL. You will have a blast
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Wouldn’t a tail dragged be harder to learn? Honest question.
 
asicer said:
So you're worried he won't be a CFII after you mention it to him? :D

But a little more seriously, I take it that the Bonanza purchase was recent so a couple questions would be: What was he flying before that? Did you fly with him much and were you pick up anything via osmosis? Things like being comfortable on the radio, knowing the sight-picture and knowing what to expect during certain phases of flight can get you a leg up. At the very least, you can gain a bit of insight being in the right seat of the Bonanza while you beat up on the flight school's 152/172/Warrior learning how to land.
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Piper Cherokee before.. and he flies a B206 for the Sheriff Dept I work for. I’ve flown with him but never paid attention to how he does it.. if that makes since. I’ve always been a JAFO.
 
asicer said:
A bit like learning to drive and learning stick shift at the same time.
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Ah.. okay. I learned to drive.. 10 years later I did stick shift.. a year later I learned a motorcycle. So, I may be a little slow in that department.
 
You certainly can learn to fly in the Bonanza but you won't progress as quickly and it may cost a lot more in insurance.

Learning to fly in a simpler airplane would be less intimidating, at first, and your progress would be faster. It would make it easier for you to learn the basics of flying an airplane. The transition to the Bonanza later would not be a problem. I'm not sure it would save much money, though, as you'd be paying a rental rate plus an instructor fee instead of the operating costs of your airplane and your husband's free instruction.

Let him know of your interest and start getting more involved, and doing some of the flying, when you're flying with him now.
 
jsstevens said:
While what I wrote is true, go with @Ryan F. He’s an instructor and DPE. I’m just a pilot.
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Thanks. That seems to be the consensus. I’d love to learn to fly on the down low and surprise my husband. Luckily we have a training facility about 10 miles from where I live. I will check them out! Thanks!
 
Ryan F. said:
Jessica,

Ideally, no. Your husband's Bonanza, while an excellent aircraft, is not a good primary trainer. It is a high performance, complex airplane. In flight training we like to do things in stages - crawl before we walk, walk before we run. Most student pilots learn in an airplane like the one you described rather than an F33. It will make for a more enjoyable experience with less frustration and a higher margin of safety. If I had to hazard a bet as to whether your husband will agree when you discuss it with him, I'd put my money on his agreement with those thoughts.
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Sound advice, thank you.
 
Jessica Palmer said:
Wouldn’t a tail dragged be harder to learn? Honest question.
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It's about the same. You could ground loop the Taylorcraft or gear-up the Bonanza. There are more ways you could hurt the Bonanza, but if you knew a really competent instructor, it wouldn't be inconceivable that you could do it in the Bo. You also don't have to budget for a new plane, and get more usage per overhead out of the plane you already have.
That said, there are reasons one could see either way. If a competent instructor taught you from flight 1 to deal with the engine, prop, and gear, you might have a better basis to do that well after you get your certificate. OTOH, it'd be more comfortable soloing in a Cessna 172, but you will need to get proficient in the Bonanza and not forget the gear, for instance.
 
Larry in TN said:
You certainly can learn to fly in the Bonanza but you won't progress as quickly and it may cost a lot more in insurance.

Learning to fly in a simpler airplane would be less intimidating, at first, and your progress would be faster. It would make it easier for you to learn the basics of flying an airplane. The transition to the Bonanza later would not be a problem. I'm not sure it would save much money, though, as you'd be paying a rental rate plus an instructor fee instead of the operating costs of your airplane and your husband's free instruction.

Let him know of your interest and start getting more involved, and doing some of the flying, when you're flying with him now.
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He’s offered to let me take off.. and lower the landing gears on final. I’ll take it! I’ll just go with Flight Venture in Olive Branch for actual lessons.
 
RyanShort1 said:
It's about the same. You could ground loop the Taylorcraft or gear-up the Bonanza. There are more ways you could hurt the Bonanza, but if you knew a really competent instructor, it wouldn't be inconceivable that you could do it in the Bo. You also don't have to budget for a new plane, and get more usage per overhead out of the plane you already have.
That said, there are reasons one could see either way. If a competent instructor taught you from flight 1 to deal with the engine, prop, and gear, you might have a better basis to do that well after you get your certificate. OTOH, it'd be more comfortable soloing in a Cessna 172, but you will need to get proficient in the Bonanza and not forget the gear, for instance.
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True.. and I certainly don’t wanna send a gear through the wing on a super hard landing.. so, I’ll pass. I guess a 172 will be my learner!
 
If you guys own a F33, learn in the F33. Plenty of pilots out there learning to fly in turbines... for a 'complex' aircraft I wouldn't consider an F33 that 'complex'.
 
OkieAviator said:
If you guys own a F33, learn in the F33. Plenty of pilots out there learning to fly in turbines... for a 'complex' aircraft I wouldn't consider an F33 that 'complex'.
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Respectfully, I disagree. The pilots learning to fly in turbine aircraft are generally ab-initio trainees who entered the program after being vetted by the employer and appearing with extensive ground study complete. Further, their training is generally full-time and the potential for "wash-out" is always present. It's a challenging, full-time commitment.

The scenario presented here is more typical of what we see in the United States for persons interested in obtaining a private pilot certificate. Though possible (correct me if I'm wrong, Jessica?) it does not seem likely that Jessica Palmer is ready to drop everything and commit to an immersive ground and flight training schedule. This is most likely a part-time endeavor which favors the fixed gear, fixed pitch prop "trainer" airplane and nominal private pilot syllabus and requisite schedule.

The F33 is a complicated single engine airplane for a new pilot. It's high-performance. It's fast, it has retractable landing gear, it has a constant speed prop. It's not designed for training. It's designed for travel. A great aircraft, to be sure. But not at all ideal for the part-time student pilot. Technically possible, yes. Advisable? Not particularly. These statements simply represent my opinion based on my personal experience.
 
Ryan F. said:
Respectfully, I disagree. The pilots learning to fly in turbine aircraft are generally ab-initio trainees who entered the program after being vetted by the employer and appearing with extensive ground study complete. Further, their training is generally full-time and the potential for "wash-out" is always present. It's a challenging, full-time commitment.

The scenario presented here is more typical of what we see in the United States for persons interested in obtaining a private pilot certificate. Though possible (correct me if I'm wrong, Jessica?) it does not seem likely that Jessica Palmer is ready to drop everything and commit to an immersive ground and flight training schedule. This is most likely a part-time endeavor which favors the fixed gear, fixed pitch prop "trainer" airplane and nominal private pilot syllabus and requisite schedule.

The F33 is a complicated single engine airplane for a new pilot. It's high-performance. It's fast, it has retractable landing gear, it has a constant speed prop. It's not designed for training. It's designed for travel. A great aircraft, to be sure. But not at all ideal for the part-time student pilot. Technically possible, yes. Advisable? Not particularly. These statements simply represent my opinion based on my personal experience.
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Thank you for your honest answer. I do have a full time job and would only have weekends to devote to learning. I will just go with my local beginners flight school at my own pace. I was just wanting to feel out the “water”, so to speak, on what others thought before I broached the subject with my husband. I did not want him to feel torn. It may seem silly but I didn’t want to put him on the spot over it.
 
If my SO had an F33, there is no question I would train in it. When you add up the training in 172 and the transition time to F33, plus the huge hassle and expense of going through a flight school (compared to your plane and your husband), I think it's a much better decision to go with the F33. I bought my 182 before my first lesson. The only thing that's different is the gear, so no big deal.
 
Jessica Palmer said:
Thank you for your honest answer. I do have a full time job and would only have weekends to devote to learning. I will just go with my local beginners flight school at my own pace. I was just wanting to feel out the “water”, so to speak, on what others thought before I broached the subject with my husband. I did not want him to feel torn. It may seem silly but I didn’t want to put him on the spot over it.
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Find yourself someone who will teach you in a simple tailwheel airplane. You'll have fun, it'll be less stressful and you have the excuse for your husband that his beautiful Bonanza has the 3rd wheel in the wrong place, so he won't be offended you left him (to train elsewhere :D ).

Seriously, if you are learning on weekends keep it simple. There will be plenty of time to fly the Bo later.
 
Alternative option - do all of the building block stuff up to and including solo flights in a traditional trainer, and then start learning and do it all over again in the Bonanza, eventually getting to the point where you'll solo that and finish out your rating in it. If that's what you're going to fly when you get your ticket, you might as well. Yes, by definition, the Bonanza is a complex airplane, but if you can learn how to land an airplane, you can be taught how to manage one more lever and to put the gear up and down. I'm over simplifying this of course. I know a guy who started flying his Mirage that he bought prior to earning his private, he spent a bunch of time with me in the airplane, went to Mirage school, and did his instrument ticket in the airplane while he was learning it. Out on his own in a Mirage with 120 flight hours, and he flies it expertly. With enough good training, you could learn to fly in a jet! Remember, the military frequently does primary training in the T6 Texan II...and they used to do it in the Beechcraft Mentor, look familiar? The only thing I worry about with the Bonanza in the training environment is the abuse put on the engine. Those big continentals aren't as bulletproof as those 4 cylinder Lycomings.
 
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