Best Plane for 150-200 NM Trips

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Elijah Baker

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SCPilot1161
Looking for recommendations for the best plane for the following mission:
2 people plus light bags (30 lbs of bags max). Max 200 NM distance. Planes I am currently considering: Piper Colt, Piper Tri-Pacer, and Grumman AA1. Would like to keep purchase price under $40k if possible and operating costs as low as possible. Location is southeast US. Any thoughts on the planes I currently have selected for this mission? Any additional to also consider? Thanks!
 
Here you go...
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What 911(ish) am I looking at there?
 
A Cessna 120/140 all day long!

get your tailwheel, they drink 5gph at 100mph give or take depending on prop-so pretty fast for their appetite, doggedly simple to maintain, an absolute joy to fly, they start a conversation at every fuel pump ya stop at… they are aluminum fuselage with cloth wings over aluminum so if they have good modern fabric on em when ya get it and it’s hangared it’s darn near lifetime fabric as it’s not over steel tube.

I’ve taken mine in three 1000+ mile cross countries and she did great on all. The distance you are looking for they fit the bill forward and backwards.
 
Huckster79 said:
A Cessna 120/140 all day long!

get your tailwheel, they drink 5gph at 100mph give or take depending on prop-so pretty fast for their appetite, doggedly simple to maintain, an absolute joy to fly, they start a conversation at every fuel pump ya stop at… they are aluminum fuselage with cloth wings over aluminum so if they have good modern fabric on em when ya get it and it’s hangared it’s darn near lifetime fabric as it’s not over steel tube.

I’ve taken mine in three 1000+ mile cross countries and she did great on all. The distance you are looking for they fit the bill forward and backwards.
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But if you didn't do the tailwheel, the Colt would beat it all around except perhaps glide and fabric. It's faster than a 150 and can carry more and carries more gas...
 
RyanShort1 said:
But if you didn't do the tailwheel, the Colt would beat it all around except perhaps glide and fabric. It's faster than a 150 and can carry more and carries more gas...
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certainly a good option too. The TW is not that daunting though and ya eliminate the need to recover it to inspect steel. Not sure he needs a ton of gas as far as he’s going. But no doubt both would be options really. How fast is the colt?
 
Will you have a hangar? That would be the determining factor between a fabric/metal airplane in my book
 
The Grumman will be noticeably faster then the Colt or Tri-Pacer.
My PA-17 is (barely) 2 passenger, full fuel and some baggage.
It will fly 250 miles on 12 gallons, and will get there (barely) faster than a car that is not speeding.
Then add the time to drive to the airport, load up the plane, pre-flight it, get it out of the hanger, put your car in the hanger, and the wait time to get to the front of the line to go.
Everyone forgets that part.
Then tie it down, unload it and drive to your destination.
Everyone forgets that part, also.

I see you can get a medium time Lear for a pretty good price these days.
Something like that will beat a car, for sure.

OK. Almost always, the plane will be more fun.
Except for the driving, loading, pre-flight, vehicle switching, tiedown, unloading and driving part.
 
AA1's are kind of payload limited and runway hogs compared to the competition. Basically you have to compromise something for the speed comparatively. If you plan on 2500' grass with trees at the end, you might want to rethink that.
 
A stock AA-1 will not be workable. It can carry two small people and a toothbrush with full fuel on a good day. And only 3+40 fuel, which means you better be over an airport at 3 hours. It blocks at 125 mph (108 kt) at 6 gph but can't really carry anything. BTDT.

An AA-5 is the black sheep of the Grumman AA-5x line, and you may find a bargain there. It will cruise at 115 kt or more depending on your model at about 8 gph. Easily carries two plus all the luggage you want. 200-300 nm is a good range for an AA-5 with IFR reserves. Grummans are fairly simple to maintain. Tigers and Cheetahs are faster and carry more fuel, but cost more. Any of the 150 hp models with the high compression STC will climb well.

Flying will cut your time about in half to one third, not counting ground transport at the other end or crazy IFR routings. Headwinds can make the comparison between driving and flying this kind of plane (100-120 kt) embarrassing. I've been passed by tractor trailers along the NYS Thruway on a breezy fall day flying west. And had to stop and refuel to get home. ☹
 
chemgeek said:
Easily carries two plus all the luggage you want.
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...because it has fold-down rear seats (I'm sure you meant to mention this but got lost in the editing)

In a 150hp AA5, leaving them folded down 24/7 is a smart idea.
 
How long does it take to drive this distance? Some 200 nm mile trips are better driven by car(straight interstate) while others are more easily flown(think no direct roads, multiple towns, 2 lane highways). I have two daughters that both live 400nm away, one easily driven, the other harder to drive and more easily flown. It does make a difference when you figure maintenance, second car, usual head winds. It takes me 45” to get to airport, load, preflight, fuel, take off. I live only 5 miles from the airport. Same true when I return home.
 
asicer said:
...because it has fold-down rear seats (I'm sure you meant to mention this but got lost in the editing)

In a 150hp AA5, leaving them folded down 24/7 is a smart idea.
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Yes, when we go shopping at LL Bean near Portland, we have to fold down the seats to load up all the stuff. The cargo area is huge in that config. The seat backs stay at home in that config, saving a few pounds.
 
F1 or Harmon Rocket… anything else and the line guys will make fun of you when you leave.
 
I liked my Luscombe a lot. Meets your wants at 105 MPH & 4 GPH, but NORDO. I have time in all the PA-22's. Colt, Tripe 135,150, 160 and like them all. I still don't see how a 160 HP Tripacer with 4 aboard blew the doors off a 172 with all that drag. But it did. They're selling in the twenty's.
 
One thing about the Colt. I don't see why Piper couldn't put rear windows in them.
 
Zenith Ch601 / 650 meets your mission. More modern aircraft, easy to update avionics, etc.. The 360 degree view is a great way to fly.
 
Lndwarrior said:
Zenith Ch601 / 650 meets your mission. More modern aircraft, easy to update avionics, etc.. The 360 degree view is a great way to fly.
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How are those? I've seen a few in the wild lately but never see the pilots around to pick their brains. I have a similar mission as the OP except I don't know if my wife could keep packing to 30lb.
 
Eldorado said:
How long does it take to drive this distance? Some 200 nm mile trips are better driven by car(straight interstate) while others are more easily flown(think no direct roads, multiple towns, 2 lane highways). I have two daughters that both live 400nm away, one easily driven, the other harder to drive and more easily flown. It does make a difference when you figure maintenance, second car, usual head winds. It takes me 45” to get to airport, load, preflight, fuel, take off. I live only 5 miles from the airport. Same true when I return home.
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Unless it's across water, the road distance is much longer, traffic is terrible — or you already live in an airpark and are visiting another one — flying rarely makes time sense for 150–200 nm. But it's definitely more fun.

A good rule of thumb is to add 2 hours to the flight time to get your door to door time — half an hour to get to the airport, half an hour to get the plane ready, half an hour to secure the plane, and half an hour to drive from the airport to your destination. Even a very fast plane is barely going to beat your door-to-door driving time for 150 nm.
 
In addition to being more fun, I find 4 hours door-to-door (2 hours of flying plus an hour on either end) much less fatiguing than 5 hours of driving...
 
I fly a 30 nm trip for a monthly meeting with some regularity. It would be a 50-mile drive. It’s such a short flight that the total trip time is inversely proportional to the speed of the plane. (Preflight on a J-3 is a lot quicker than on a complex plane.)

And I agree, unless the weather is really bad, driving is more fatiguing than flying. Nobody drifts into my lane or passes coming over the hill when I’m in the air. Edit to add: And relaxing for two seconds won't lead to my airplane going into the other lane or into the ditch and killing me the way it can in a car.
 
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Those that do live with their planes on an air park have a distinctly different experience with small plane travel. I’m coming up on 25 years on 8NC8 in NC and have owned a 180HP TW Maule and am currently flying an RV10.

The Maule would fly 117NM/hr at about 11gph, dropping to 113NM/hr after 1500hours. It flew from upstate NY to Pgh to Houston and quite few times to FL but the milk run was a weekly 107NM trip between Durham and Lake Norman to visit friends with a lake house. The flight was 1 hour+ going and <hour returning west to east. But door to door the trip was 1:40 going and 1:30 returning compared to 2:40 by car assuming no stops. It was an ideal mission for the plane, our home, our hangar and our friends.

OTOH though trips to FL were a joy, they were long at that speed. Traveling on your own schedule and skipping the post-9/11 hassles had it’s pleasures but as the RV10 began taking shape, it was impossible to ignore the impact of speed and more comfort. Speed is king beyond 200NM.

The milk run for the RV10 was Durham NC to KAGC in Pgh PA. At a 160knots with an autopilot, the trip is painless though the instrument ticket is critical. The only thing missing is anti-ice. Conversely, in a car I’m told the trip is 5.5 hours plus stops. I’ll never make that drive.

Living with your plane changes a lot. The SE US has lots of high quality airports, especially in NC, and there’s lot’s of direct routing. Icing is rarely and issue. Though speed is king, so is an instrument ticket and an autopilot for dispatch reliability and comfort respectively.

…and living with your plane keeps the mileage on your car low and trips through airport security few.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro
 
chemgeek said:
Yes, when we go shopping at LL Bean near Portland, we have to fold down the seats to load up all the stuff. The cargo area is huge in that config. The seat backs stay at home in that config, saving a few pounds.
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When I had my Tiger, I folded down the seats after Hurricane Michael crushed the gulf. Was able to fly full fuel, two large generators, two pole gas chain saws, etc. down there to help out. One Cheetah owner I know pulled the seats day one of ownership and never looked back. While I had a Tiger, they are overpriced. The traveler and cheetahs can be found for reasonable prices. Take a look at those.
 
There are a lot of airplanes you could use for this. Airframes with 1400-1600 hours SMOH are probably the least expensive for each type, but may not hold resale as well after putting 300-500 hours in 8-12 years of ownership. But going this route puts short frame Mooneys on your list. I paid 40 AMUs for my 64 Super21, and Mark 21s are less. Just a thought
 
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David Megginson said:
A good rule of thumb is to add 2 hours to the flight time to get your door to door time — half an hour to get to the airport, half an hour to get the plane ready, half an hour to secure the plane, and half an hour to drive from the airport to your destination.
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that is a lot of time. I fly to my job quite a bit, for me it is 15, 15, 15, 15, all of which is pretty laid back. 80 mph on the interstate, dry and daytime, I find pretty stressful. Add dark, rain, ice or snow and it is way stressful. The flight on the other hand is relaxing. Would almost always fly 200 nm. My shortest milk run is 136 nm. 2 hrs by car at hwy speed )80 mph), 1:20 by air door to door, and I arrive rested and relaxed. Of course depending on plane and pilot, YMMV.
 
Rockymountain said:
that is a lot of time. I fly to my job quite a bit, for me it is 15, 15, 15, 15, all of which is pretty laid back.
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That part is true. For me it's 10+20+10+10. However, @David Megginson forgot to add startup, taxi, run-up, pattern exit, pattern entry and shutdown. From my experience in rentals where I always had an eye on the Hobbs, that adds something in the 0.5-0.7 range
 
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