Beat up Lance

Lance F

Lance F

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Lance F
Brutally second guessing a poster's ADM (aeronautical decision making) is a thing of beauty on many threads. Well take a poke at me...if you think I deserve it:D

The mission this morning was to fly two potential customers whom I have never met from Indianapolis to Memphis, look at a reference installation and return. They are evaluating the capital equipment I sell for what would be a great project. The trip would be done in my Mooney M20J.

One had about 20 hours starting on his PPL about 10 years ago and not been in a small plane since. The other never in a small plane.

The weather was beautiful in Indy and we planned an 8:30am departure. Normal flight time would be about 2 1/2 hours. However ther were major thunderstorms aiming right at Memphis.

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/N57039/history/20110628/1230Z/KUMP/KAWM

I briefed them that weather could cause a deviation, delay, or even a turn around and go back.

I tracked the line on XM NEXRAD and made the decision halfway there to go around the back side of the line. On Memphis Center there was nothing but talk of the jetliners deviating all over the sky.

The deviation and headwinds made the flight a long 3;15, and there were definitely bumps in the Memphis area. But nothing that was too bad. They got their tour, saw the equipment and got home safely.

So, was this a great use of GA to further one's business or a foolish risk to a couple of guys that didnt understand what they were getting into?
 
XM WX and spherics, flying the stoutest airframe in the fleet? Non-event, well-played.
 
You made it in one piece so it obviously was a good decision. :D

Much better to go around the back side of the storms than the front.
 
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Lance F said:
So, was this a great use of GA to further one's business or a foolish risk to a couple of guys that didnt understand what they were getting into?
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Good use of GA for business. You understood the risks and used your tools knowledgeably and appropriately.

I just don't envy you going through bumpy areas in a Mooney. :)
 
who paid for what?
 
Lance F said:
I paid for everything. I'm visiting their factory in Indy today. Maybe they'll buy lunch. Is that allowed?
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That depends. It's fine so long as the PoA Anal-Retentive FAR squad doesn't find out about it. :D
 
show off ... :D

Nicely done! And best of luck on closing the deal.
 
Looked like any other normal flight to me; make your plans, brief the passengers, have a plan a-c then deal with the weather. Where people get into trouble is they'll plan min fuel +45 then get into the weather with no options.
 
It depends on if you close the deal or not. :D

Sounds like a good trip to me. Showing the full 'utility' of GA - it doesn't have to be clear and sunny to fly GA and we have the ability to make informed decisions just like the 'big guys'.
 
Baron2PG said:
Where people get into trouble is they'll plan min fuel +45 then get into the weather with no options.
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Exactly. Where those people tend to get complacent especially is believing that because they've always gotten away with it, that will continue to be the case. It'll be true until it ain't.
 
Lance F said:
I paid for everything.

Totally legal.

I'm visiting their factory in Indy today. Maybe they'll buy lunch. Is that allowed?
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You are flying your self, that is all the FAA cares about, who pays for lunch is none of their business,.nor do they care.
 
Lance,

You suck. I wish I could fly myself on company business, but it's not allowed. Sounds like you demonstrated the flexibility of GA just fine. :D
 
Lance,
I can't believe you took innocent people up in that death trap!
-Joel

P.S. I flew safety pilot last night with my buddy in his M-20J.
 
What was supposed to be wrong here? You set out on a mission, played the developing situation by ear maintaining options and making decisions and little deviations to give Mother Nature Right of Way (you obviously understood what the weather was doing and was likely to do) and completed the mission. It must a tough moral transition going from Jet Jock to Utility/Business pilot....:D;)
 
Lance F said:
I paid for everything. I'm visiting their factory in Indy today. Maybe they'll buy lunch. Is that allowed?
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Depends on whats for lunch!:D

Good use of GA by the way what was with the last altitude? Did you really shoot up 2000' in an updraft?
 
YOU LET STRANGERS GET IN THE AIRPLANE WITH YOU????? OMG You are lucky you didn't DIE!!! :rofl:

(someone has to give you a hard time about something, eh?)
 
Probably not best to start the passenger briefing with "You know, there's a very good chance that we will not make it." while really referring to possible weather deviations/cancellations.
 
I'm curious if the passengers made any comments.
 
Everskyward said:
I'm curious if the passengers made any comments.
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I tend to fly passengers pretty low, my ex wife especially, "just keep it down between the trees" "ok baby".... Most non pilot passengers love it down around 250'. It's a great way to see the country go by, it really is. Pilot passengers are a bit shaky below 1500' usually until they become familiar. There is a whole lot of this country it doesn't much matter what altitude you are flying. It's either pretty much landable everywhere from a few hundred feet, or it's so rugged that glide range doesn't much matter unless you know the terrain intimately, it's just luck of the draw. Most of the country SE Day VFR is glideable to a survivable landing spot from around 4000' AGL, give or take a thousand for glide ratio.
 
Everskyward said:
I'm curious if the passengers made any comments.
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Not to me directly, but I heard one on his phone commenting on the deviation for weather and the extended flight time because of that. Also mentioned it being rough. But he didn't sound like it was a big deal. The other guy slept some going back, so that was a good sign.

I think it was right to brief them about the destination weather. I did NOT say there was a good chance of not making it, just that it was a possibility. I figured with all that red stuff on the MFD staring them in the face, it would be pretty hard to hide what was in front of us.

BTW, ANYONE can fly a plane for business. Start your own business and set your own rules. It's the American way. I did not do it by choice. But once in it, I wish I'd made the move long ago. And that's the truth.
 
Lance F said:
Not to me directly, but I heard one on his phone commenting on the deviation for weather and the extended flight time because of that. Also mentioned it being rough. But he didn't sound like it was a big deal. The other guy slept some going back, so that was a good sign.

I think it was right to brief them about the destination weather. I did NOT say there was a good chance of not making it, just that it was a possibility. I figured with all that red stuff on the MFD staring them in the face, it would be pretty hard to hide what was in front of us.

BTW, ANYONE can fly a plane for business. Start your own business and set your own rules. It's the American way. I did not do it by choice. But once in it, I wish I'd made the move long ago. And that's the truth.
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Of course you brief the weather and any other anomalies you may come across. That way when it happens they'll be "Yep, he said this would happen and he was ok with it then" rather than "Whoa, what's this s-t?"

I always brief the weather and give em a last, "You sure?" before we go. I do the same thing to couples before I marry them. I take them aside and ask, "You sure? Last Chance...Ok". I like people to be informed before I scar them for life....:yikes::rofl:
 
Lance F said:
Not to me directly, but I heard one on his phone commenting on the deviation for weather and the extended flight time because of that. Also mentioned it being rough. But he didn't sound like it was a big deal. The other guy slept some going back, so that was a good sign.
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I've noticed that passengers are much more bothered by turbulence than, say, doing an ILS to minimums in the snow. They just think that's magic, how the runway appears out of nowhere.

Lance F said:
I think it was right to brief them about the destination weather. I did NOT say there was a good chance of not making it, just that it was a possibility. I figured with all that red stuff on the MFD staring them in the face, it would be pretty hard to hide what was in front of us.
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I think it's always good to tell them what to expect as far as weather goes, especially if it's going to be bad. I'll also tell them if it marginal whether or not we can get there and I'll give them some options since it's their money if we need to divert or turn around and come home due to weather. That wouldn't be the case in your situation, though.
 
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