Banning Pass SoCal

RalphInCA

RalphInCA

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RalphInCA
For those of you who fly in the Southern California area:

How hard is it to get through the banning pass to Palm Springs? I have heard talk about severe turbulence especially in the summer.

Would you do it as a low time Pilot anyone 172? What altitude would you use? Differences in flying conditions between headed East versus West?



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All of my worst turbulence rides have been through there. I've also been through there when everywhere else was awful and it was smooth as glass.

I have a bad ride through there 1 out of 5 times. A real bad one maybe 1 in 20.

I think the turb is better at 10k than 4k, but this is anecdotal, not scientific, and I seldom fly through there at 4/6k anyway, but I hear plenty of guys griping at 4 and 6k when its nice at 8 or 10.

SoCal are used to being asked "how's the ride in the pass?" and if they don't know, they'll query the others in there.

Every so often you can listen to both sides of the convo:

"cherokee 12345, how's your ride?"

"m-m-m-m-m-m-moderate ch-chop"

:D

It's just turbulence. It won't wreck the plane. It might wreck your upholstery. It might knock your headset off. Don't take newbies through there, but for a new pilot, strap in, buckle up, and leave enough room for a U-turn. I fly the right side of the passage so I can U turn left if it's too miserable.

$0.02

- Mike
 
As for the east vs. west question, VERY good!

Approaching the pass with significant headwind is much riskier than with significant tailwind. Air is likely to be descending on the leeward side.

If you approach the pass with a tailwind and you suddenly start climbing, tell SOCAL you're encountering rising air and you're riding it. Then maintain attitude and let it climb. It will come back down on the other side.

The one thing you really do not want to do is attempt to climb against descending air when you can't keep up. For that, you get the nose DOWN and get the $#@^ out of there at high airspeed. Approach the leeward side at high altitude to make room for that.

Note that rising/descending air does not have to mean turbulence. Mountain wave activity can be very smooth. You can get some really high airspeed climbs in those (though glider technique says to slow it down so you stay in the rising air longer).

All this stuff is likely to be much less of an issue early in the morning. Same deal with density altitude. The Palm Springs may be right at sea level, but it gets ridiculously hot. Watch heat exhaustion and dehydration, as your motor skills suffer pretty early. I've had my worst landings under those conditions.

Some turbulence CAN wreck the plane, by causing loss of control and overspeeding. That's what extreme turbulence does. Moderate will not, but you have to plan for it (e.g., don't wear an unmodified ball cap and don't put anything unsecured in the back you don't want to be hit in the back of the head with).
 
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I've flown that pass a zillion times, it'll take your handheld mic off its hook occasionally, there is a reason they have all those wind turbines down there.

I've had student pilots fly it, no biggie, banning airport is also the cheapest place for fuel shy of big bear.

As long as you don't have some strange fear of turbulence it's fine, if you or your pax can't handle the chop go south west and over BALDI intersection which will drop you off smack dab in the middle of KPSP, KUDD and Jakie.
 
Morning is better than afternoon when the heating sets in.......don't blow it up to be a giant ogre........it's just a pass.......I usually just ran thru at 5-6K .......back the speed down to a comfortable maneuvering spot and enjoy the ride, when you peek around the corner on the East side its a pretty neat view of the desert. We used to have twin otters flying through that thing 30 times a day back in the 70's and I didn't see any wings falling off.........lol.......
 
Good stuff guys thanks.

What is the best way to determine conditions in the past before I take off? Are there cloud indicators that I should pay attention to?
 
schmookeeg said:
I hadn't heard this one before, and you got my curiosity up -- what's the deal with ballcaps in a bumpy plane? :)
Click to expand...

I think he is talking about removing the little button on the top of most ball caps. I've never had a problem with it, but apparently some folks have gotten a dent in their head from hitting the headliner.
 
RalphInCA said:
Good stuff guys thanks.

What is the best way to determine conditions in the past before I take off? Are there cloud indicators that I should pay attention to?
Click to expand...


Well you could check the weather at Banning airport (951) 922-4674, if its nuking (especially if its hot) it probably going to be a little more bumpy.

Honestly it's not that big of a deal, nor is it that long of a flight to get through the pass.
 
RalphInCA said:
For those of you who fly in the Southern California area:

How hard is it to get through the banning pass to Palm Springs?
Click to expand...

Plan your trip as early as possible in the day. The sun heats the desert, the thermals start to rise, and the LA basin atmosphere gets sucked into the desert with significant velocity. -Skip
 
Fearless Tower said:
I think he is talking about removing the little button on the top of most ball caps. I've never had a problem with it, but apparently some folks have gotten a dent in their head from hitting the headliner.
Click to expand...
That's why the caps AOPA gives out don't have the buttons. Even absent turbulence, some types of headset bows press down on that button and get real uncomfortable real quick.
 
RalphInCA said:
For those of you who fly in the Southern California area:

How hard is it to get through the banning pass to Palm Springs? I have heard talk about severe turbulence especially in the summer.

Would you do it as a low time Pilot anyone 172? What altitude would you use? Differences in flying conditions between headed East versus West?



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

:confused: It's easy, if it's really rough just slow down to below VA, tighten your belt, and hang on. Landing at PSP isn't usually traumatic. I did it solo in a 152 as a student pilot. Unless the Santana's are blowing, it's not going to be bad.
 
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Skip Miller said:
Plan your trip as early as possible in the day. The sun heats the desert, the thermals start to rise, and the LA basin atmosphere gets sucked into the desert with significant velocity. -Skip
Click to expand...

That's not really bad though, the onshore winds rarely get above 20, it's when the flow reverses and the wind is blowing from the desert to the sea is when you get the 70kt winds tumbling off the mountains into the basin that it gets rough, especially when the cars are passing you.
 
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