Avgas Prices

Mxfarm said:
metric isn’t that bad, and not that hard, unless you enjoy fraction math. :rolleyes:
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not saying metric is bad.

and there is nothing hard about fractions...
 
TommyG said:
Come out to Long Island NY, average is $9 a gallon now.
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Flew into FOK last Wednesday, took on 10 gallons at $8.10 a gallon. Eye opener for me, as I use 91 octane non ethanol auto fuel, which I currently source for $5.45 a gallon. A year ago it was $3.49-4.30..
 
TomF said:
Time to get in the gas station sign business before every station has to add another digit.
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You know what they did here in Canada? They just move the decimal place on some signs. This was years ago we went from cents per liter to dollars.
 
They price it in liters back home too; I got the wife and kiddo spending the summer down there and I tell them to send me some gas stations posts to troll my coworkers in TX with.
 
The home drome cost for a gallon of 100LL went up a dollar to $7.70 this weekend.:(
 
NorthEast Ohio said:
Prices come down, When Vlad kicks the bucket and RU crude flows freely
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Russia is making more oil money now than before the sanctions.

What has stopped is American oil production. We have to build pipelines, open leases and stop retracting leases already granted.

We are doing this to ourselves.
 
I wouldn’t say “we”, I’d say He or They are.
 
LesGawlik said:
What has stopped is American oil production. We have to build pipelines, open leases and stop retracting leases already granted.

We are doing this to ourselves.
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Not sure what you're basing that on, but the U.S. is still the world's largest oil producer (slightly ahead of Saudi Arabia and Russia). U.S. production dropped sharply in the spring of 2020, during the first Covid wave, because demand evaporated.

upload_2022-6-20_18-32-4.png
It has been ratcheting back upward ever since, buffeted by the usual influences (storms in the Gulf, etc.), but is still below 2019 levels. Most of the things you're talking about (new leases, building pipelines, etc.) are long-horizon items, not short-term solutions.
 
Well ok then - I guess everything is fine, nothing to worry about. Nothing can be done. And everything that can be done is being done.
 
We were energy independent, and now we are on our knees to Saudi Arabia, Venezuela, Iran, and surreptitiously Russia. The Keystone XL Pipeline was cancelled, taking away thousands of American jobs, reducing domestic energy production, and driving up the cost of oil. Oil and gas leases in the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge and New Mexico have been suspended. The EPA reinstalled regulations that restrict domestic energy production, including resurrecting the “Waters of the United States” rule that limits how farmers and ranchers can use their land.
 
LesGawlik said:
We were energy independent,
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FYI: the US was never 100% energy independent. We were independent with some finished petroleum products but not all. The current problem is a refining problem that is very complex. However, there was a thread back in March on PoA that got into the turbine fuel side for reference. In basic terms, just as the coutry stripped the inventories of toilet paper, chips, tires, etc over the last 2 years the same happened to fuels. Unfortunately, our refinary capacity is finite and still not operating at "100%" which it never does. Could we be in a better place... maybe. But with the current agenda out there it will definitly take longer to get back to "normal."
 
I see $10 now….one good thing is now I can tell when advertised fuel prices are wrong and haven’t been updated.
 
MooneyDriver78 said:
I see $10 now….one good thing is now I can tell when advertised fuel prices are wrong and haven’t been updated.
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Yikes, that’s a high price. Care to explain on this new method of catching wrong prices? Calling ahead to confirm is the old tried and true method, but it is much easier to see a map or list of fuel prices when planning a long trip.
 
Bell206 said:
FYI: the US was never 100% energy independent.
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From Axios:

The intrigue: It's elusive no more. The U.S. produced more petroleum than it consumed in 2020, and the numbers were essentially in balance in 2021, according to the Energy Information Administration.
 
TrueCourse said:
Yikes, that’s a high price. Care to explain on this new method of catching wrong prices? Calling ahead to confirm is the old tried and true method, but it is much easier to see a map or list of fuel prices when planning a long trip.
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Garmin Pilot colorizes the prices (Green, Yellow, Red), if I see a green (<$5) I know it’s old.
Almost everything is now red (>$6), even the normally cheap airports.
Dawson (16J) is an example.
 
Ah. Same thing ForeFlight does. I remember FltPlan.com did this years ago, but their map wasn’t as user friendly as the ones offered today. I’m hearing more complaints from pilots discovering the published prices are not being updated.
 
LesGawlik said:
From Axios: The intrigue: It's elusive no more. The U.S. produced more petroleum than it consumed in 2020, and the numbers were essentially in balance in 2021, according to the Energy Information Administration.
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Not quite. While the US is a net exporter of energy products (just barely now) we still import over 8M barrels a day. Hardly energy independent. As I stated above we are/were independent with certain finished products which I believe were certain grades of gasoline and several other products but not all oil consumables. The actual data/facts from the EIA state otherwise. Those headlines made for a nice soundbite. So until the US stops importing the 8M barrels or equivalents of oil products from Canada, Mexico, and others AND increases the domestic refinery capability to hand those 8M barrels we are not "energy dependent." The energy system is not as simple as portrayed publicly by various individuals. And given how the current agendas out there are undermining that system vs shoring it up will keep us in this current situation for quite some time.
 
LesGawlik said:
We were energy independent, and now we are on our knees to Saudi Arabia, Venezuela, Iran, and surreptitiously Russia. The Keystone XL Pipeline was cancelled, taking away thousands of American jobs, reducing domestic energy production, and driving up the cost of oil. Oil and gas leases in the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge and New Mexico have been suspended. The EPA reinstalled regulations that restrict domestic energy production, including resurrecting the “Waters of the United States” rule that limits how farmers and ranchers can use their land.
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lmao. Sorry but this is very funny. That pipeline might be a few thousand jobs for construction. Afterwards, it will actually reduce employment in the USA. Currently most of that oil is shipped via rail. You think companies are going to replace rail shipping with something more expensive? Nope. Not a chance.
Leases take a decade or longer to come to fruition. So none of the changes mentioned have any effect.

What has caused the prices to go crazy? Very simple. The US fully opened our O&G markets to the global market. So our prices are controlled by the world stage.

Tim
 
Decades - centuries. Not worth getting more supply because it takes too long so never do it. Not my fault - nothing can be done. Global forces. Pipeline is more expensive than rail. We should really cut costs and ship via horse drawn wagons. Gas prices just happened to triple in a year - it’s the evil unpatriotic petroleum industry.
 
It's not my fault... it's always someone else's fault <====== go to phrase
 
tspear said:
lmao. Sorry but this is very funny. That pipeline might be a few thousand jobs for construction. Afterwards, it will actually reduce employment in the USA. Currently most of that oil is shipped via rail. You think companies are going to replace rail shipping with something more expensive? Nope. Not a chance.
Leases take a decade or longer to come to fruition. So none of the changes mentioned have any effect.

What has caused the prices to go crazy? Very simple. The US fully opened our O&G markets to the global market. So our prices are controlled by the world stage.

Tim
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So rail shipment is much cheaper than using a pipeline? Who would invest in building pipelines if they'll never get business? Are there pipelines now? How do they stay solvent?
 
So they wanted to build the Key Stone pipe line because???
 
https://www.chicagobooth.edu/review/why-transporting-oil-rail-popular-despite-cost

These guys say shipping oil by rail is more expensive and less reliable. The advantage is that the infrastructure has been built. So build the pipelines, and after a while it will be part of the infrastructure.

The advantage rail has is that it is more prevalent and more flexible. But for point to point delivery of crude, pipelines seem pretty good.

Quora says:

The cost to transport crude oil or petroleum products by pipeline is a fraction of the cost of other modes of transportation. The cost to ship crude oil by rail is generally $10 to $15 per barrel versus under $5 per barrel by pipeline.
 
Guys I was being cheeky! The statement I replied too was to build the pipeline because it means jobs. I was pointing out that the pipeline actually decreases employment longer term.


Tim
 
tspear said:
What has caused the prices to go crazy? Very simple. The US fully opened our O&G markets to the global market. So our prices are controlled by the world stage.

Tim
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Allowing the selling US oil on the world market in 2016 seemed like a great idea for short term profits...
 
UngaWunga said:
Allowing the selling US oil on the world market in 2016 seemed like a great idea for short term profits...
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I plead the fifth. Or I might get a TOS warning for pointing out the stupidity of our vaunted political class.

Tim
 
tspear said:
Guys I was being cheeky! The statement I replied too was to build the pipeline because it means jobs. I was pointing out that the pipeline actually decreases employment longer term.
Tim
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Until they need to build another pipeline. Or build something else. Reducing costs by being more efficient creates wealth, which make other opportunities for people to do things (jobs). So, yes - after a specific pipeline is built those people will no longer be employed building that pipeline. But will go on to have jobs doing something.

I'll get off my Adam Smith / Milton Friedman soap box now.........
 
What we have now are the results of the promises made to us by those running for office that said they would do exactly as they have done. We the people elected the results we now have.

Perhaps we (you & I) should listen more carefully and scrutinize more clearly the things that these people wanting to ruin run our country are promising to do before we give them our vote.

We have the government we deserve as we elect them and continue to tolerate incompetence.
 
Some of y’all have no clue as to why Keystone was so important to fuel prices along with the difference between sweet and heavy crude and refineries here in the states…lots of google experts around here.
 
@WDD

I was not addressing any long term wealth or economic aspects. I was specifically commenting on the belief and the marketing pitch which was repeated and used many times that the Keystone pipeline will bring thousands of jobs which implied those are permanent jobs.

@Warlock

Unless something changed, Keystone would have zero effect on O&G today. Even if not cancelled in Jan 2021, it would have taken a decade or longer to build and get through the courts. And I always find it instructive to ask why Trans Canada did not propose a line parallel to the existing connections.
If I understand it correctly, Tar sands oil is actually significantly more expensive to refine. It is highly acidic, very sour, and extremely heavy. As a result, it does not match much of the current requirements for production in the USA. What is does match much better is refined products used in Europe.

Tim
 
tspear said:
@WDD

I was not addressing any long term wealth or economic aspects. I was specifically commenting on the belief and the marketing pitch which was repeated and used many times that the Keystone pipeline will bring thousands of jobs which implied those are permanent jobs.


Tim
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I am guessing that the thousands of families that lost their primary income would have something to say to you about that.
Ten years might not be permanent but it is a long term income.
You come off sounding elitist and uncaring. And I know that’s not your intent, right?
Jess
 
how many construction jobs are permananet?
 
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