Apparently some animals are more equal than others....

wsuffa

wsuffa

Touchdown! Greaser!
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Bill S.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/10/26/AR2010102606944.html?hpid=topnews

Sen. James M. Inhofe (R-Okla.) was flying his twin-engine Cessna 340 down to Port Isabel, Tex., on Thursday, headed to his house on South Padre Island. It's something he's done every so often for the past 50 years.

There were these huge (60 feet long by 10 feet wide) yellow X's on the main runway, which aren't there to mark the landing spot. The big signs were laid out to indicate that the runway was closed. There were workmen painting and doing general maintenance on the runway.

Inhofe, who was traveling with three others, told us Tuesday that he was "getting ready to land, then I saw a big X," and the workers and equipment. So he flew the six-seater over the workers and landed "well off to the side," he said.

.... Inhofe said he "didn't have a NOTAM."
....
On Sunday, Inhofe headed back home - but not without incident. Fortunately, he didn't try to take off on the closed runway. Actually, he didn't try to take off on any of the four bi-directional runways at the airport. He chose instead to use a taxiway.

"I really didn't have a choice," he explained, "given the size of the plane. The taxiway is very wide and long, better than the rough runways" at that airport. "There was no alternative," he said. And he notified the airport official that he intended to use the taxiway.
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Let's try and keep this out of Spin ZOne, 'K?
 
The pilots of Nancy Pelosi's 757 would never do a thing like that.
Haha, sorry. I couldn't help myself.
 
Sounds OK to me actually. I've used taxiways for runways on many more than one occasion. As for the landing, he avoided the people. Yeah, he committed several violations, didn't have the NOTAM etc, but I live by the "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone" edict, so I haven't carried any rocks in a long time. It's kinda a "home field" for him, and most of us get latitude at home field, I know I got a heck of a lot of it, and preferential treatment, at LGB in the years I was there, as well as the airports I frequented and fueled at when I was flying pipeline. If he wouldn't have been a Senator, you would not even know this happened.
 
The taxiway takeoff is a non issue but I'm wondering what it means when he said he landed well off to the side. Did he land on a closed runway or not?

Not having a NOTAM is very different from not GETTING a NOTAM. Regardless not sure where in the FARs it says its ok to land on a closed runway with yellow Xs if you don't HAVE a NOTAM. Be interesting to see if he got a briefing and what if anything the FAA will do.
 
ScottM said:
Don't try this if you have no influence with the FAA!!!
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Which was my point with the thread title. I could see an ordinary pilot reading a letter that started with the words: "Emergency certificate suspension..."
 
ScottM said:
And which 757 would that be? The one she never actually flew on?

http://www.snopes.com/politics/pelosi/jet.asp
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Sheesh. It was a dumb joke.
We don't need to bring in facts to shout down a dumb joke... because jokes are based on the specter of truth, not actual facts and evidence. Do you sit and watch Colbert just yelling at the TV, sending letters to the producers about factual inaccuracies?
 
Every time I think of not reading the NOTAMS, I remind myself of this dude, and get a briefing.
farback.jpg
 
Telemakhos said:
Sheesh. It was a dumb joke.
We don't need to bring in facts to shout down a dumb joke... because jokes are based on the specter of truth, not actual facts and evidence. Do you sit and watch Colbert just yelling at the TV, sending letters to the producers about factual inaccuracies?
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The problem was there was not a 'spector' or truth about it. It was instead an overused derp.
 
.... Inhofe said he "didn't have a NOTAM."
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!PIL 10/005 PIL RWY 13/31 CLSD​

Dumbass.

The airport has 3 other runways, albeit in "poor condition". I guess he figured the taxiway was better paved.
-harry
 
wsuffa said:
Which was my point with the thread title. I could see an ordinary pilot reading a letter that started with the words: "Emergency certificate suspension..."
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Remember after the Meigs closure all the hoops the FAA made the pilots that were trapped by Mayor Dick's little bulldoze romp go through just to use the taxiway to depart? I think it took 10 days for the FAA to evaluate Meig's taxiways to determine if they were safe enough for the little planes that needed to depart. Dicky wanted to make the pilots disassemble the planes and truck them away.
 
Telemakhos said:
Every time I think of not reading the NOTAMS, I remind myself of this dude, and get a briefing.
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ScottM said:
I am pretty sure that the guy in those photos did get a briefing and was not told the runway was under maintenance.
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http://www.waltsrchanger.com/html/c-130_crash.html

According to this there was no NOTAM and the plane landed at night.

Last week one C-23 Sherpas flew into a US operated airfield in Iraq during the day and saw there was construction equipment on the runway.
Yet there was no NOTAM (notice to airmen). A trench was being dug in the runway, and it was not marked. Its a long runway and they just landed beyond the construction. They filed a safety hazard report that was immediately forwarded to our higher headquarters and to the Air Force wing based here.

Well, it seems the construction continued and still was not marked or NOTAMed or anything. A C-130 landed on the runway the night of the 29th and didn't see the construction. It wound up going through what is now a large pit on the runway. A few pictures are attached. The C-130 was
totaled. There were several injuries to the crew and the few passengers that were on board but luckily nobody was killed. Quite a set of failures somewhere in the system regarding this improper construction nd no notifications about it.
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ScottM said:
I am pretty sure that the guy in those photos did get a briefing and was not told the runway was under maintenance.
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You really get off on correcting people.
While the guy in the photo might have received a briefing, I chose the photo in question as being representative of pilots who do not get all available information before attempting a landing. Bad information, bad luck, bad outcome.
Is that okay with you? Have I committed another error?
 
Telemakhos said:
You really get off on correcting people.
While the guy in the photo might have received a briefing, I chose the photo in question as being representative of pilots who do not get all available information before attempting a landing. Bad information, bad luck, bad outcome.
Is that okay with you? Have I committed another error?
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I was trying to let you know that from what I read there was no information to get that there was maintenance going on. Unlike the Inhofe situtation the C-130 pilot did everything right. It was the airport manger, in this case in Iraq, that had not properly notified the authorities.

The C-130 pilot is more of a poster boy for doing everything right and still getting into an accident.
 
wsuffa said:
Which was my point with the thread title. I could see an ordinary pilot reading a letter that started with the words: "Emergency certificate suspension..."
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Maybe they're just waiting for the 20 days to file a NASA report expires.
 
so does landing "well off to the side" mean that he landed on the closed runway, the taxiway, or one of the other runways?
 
tonycondon said:
so does landing "well off to the side" mean that he landed on the closed runway, the taxiway, or one of the other runways?
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It kind of sounded like that is what he did. I doubt he went for the grass along the side of the runway. The phrase sounds very much like 'weasel words' to me.
 
tonycondon said:
so does landing "well off to the side" mean that he landed on the closed runway, the taxiway, or one of the other runways?
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There's a taxiway paralleling the closed runway, I would presume he landed there. It sounds like that's what he took off from, too.
-harry
 
Well, I started a flight review at an airport where the (only) runway was closed (being repaved) so we used the parallel taxiway (with permission of the airport manager)...

So far, the FAA has yet to come after me.
 
Steve Foley said:
Maybe they're just waiting for the 20 days to file a NASA report expires.
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I thought it was 10 days, did that change when I wasn't looking? And in any case the ASRS doesn't work if the violation was deliberate (e.g. landing on a runway with PAEW and 'X's on the ends.
 
"In practice, though, suspensions are not often imposed, we're told, unless the infractions involved criminal activity - drugs, for example - or injuries or were intentional."

Are they saying that landing on a closed runway was not intentional? Given the stories I heard I would not characterize the FAA as lenient as this story seems to...
 
Does anyone among us believe that we, had we been the ones to commit this violation, would get off with anything less than a suspension at best?
 
flyersfan31 said:
Does anyone among us believe that we, had we been the ones to commit this violation, would get off with anything less than a suspension at best?
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If you don't tell anyone and you're at a non-towered airport that's not busy, nobody will likely know the difference.
 
Ted DuPuis said:
If you don't tell anyone and you're at a non-towered airport that's not busy, nobody will likely know the difference.
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From the article:

An airport official - "he hates me, I don't know why," Inhofe said - apparently was none too pleased with the use of a closed runway.
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Inhofe doesn't know why?

I'll second Andrew's comment.
 
Ted DuPuis said:
If you don't tell anyone and you're at a non-towered airport that's not busy, nobody will likely know the difference.
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There is ALWAYS some nosy miserable SOB poking around with nothing better to do than take down your tailnumber and report you. Always.
 
flyersfan31 said:
Does anyone among us believe that we, had we been the ones to commit this violation, would get off with anything less than a suspension at best?
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Yeah, probably. Remember, it's Port Isabel TX, not FDK. It's an uncontrolled field with some big runways. I landed at an airport closed for a VP visit (with clearance after a bit of an argument on the radio since there was nothing in the briefing). If there's 5 guys working on one side of the runway part way down and I determine that I can land on what's remaining without endangering anyone and do so, the reality is it's a non issue. Regardless, it's an airport management issue to pursue because airport management closes a runway, not the FAA. The FAA disseminates and enforces complaints, but if management doesn't complain, there's nothing to enforce. I've gotten away with a lot of stuff and have never been violated. It all depends on the exact situation. Remember, you're only hearing a one sided account from a sensationalistic media.
 
Henning said:
Yeah, probably. Remember, it's Port Isabel TX, not FDK. It's an uncontrolled field with some big runways. I landed at an airport closed for a VP visit (with clearance after a bit of an argument on the radio since there was nothing in the briefing). If there's 5 guys working on one side of the runway part way down and I determine that I can land on what's remaining without endangering anyone and do so, the reality is it's a non issue. Regardless, it's an airport management issue to pursue because airport management closes a runway, not the FAA. The FAA disseminates and enforces complaints, but if management doesn't complain, there's nothing to enforce. I've gotten away with a lot of stuff and have never been violated. It all depends on the exact situation. Remember, you're only hearing a one sided account from a sensationalistic media.
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Fair point. I do most of my flying in the Northeast, where grannies with binoculars tracking tailnumbers to report altitude or curfew violations are a common sight. I sometimes forget the rest of the country is less uptight about stuff that really doesn't matter.
 
I've flown to a few pilot controlled airports where we landed in the grass next to the runway. Seems like as long as you're letting everyone know what you're doing it shouldn't be an issue. And if no one else is affected by where you land, it seems to be even more of a non issue.
 
We had a guy fly in to our airport before the NOTAM for the airport being closed was lifted. The airshow was over, the crowd was mostly gone, so the Airboss (an FAA guy) didn't see any sense in making an issue of it. We cancelled the notam about 10 minutes later once I got my crew away from the runway.
 
ScottM said:
The problem was there was not a 'spector' or truth about it. It was instead an overused derp.
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Never heard about a 757, and don't want to read the pool of leftist spin at Snopes, but it's a fact that Pelosi was using AF jets like her own for years, and throwing temper tantrums whenever AF did not satisfy her whims (over not getting a Gulfstream, for example). There were also issues of chantage over money allocation for Pentagon if they did not give her the biggest VIP plane. It was nasty, absolutely unacceptable behaviour of a typical Washington insider in power. We now have Tea Party just to purge Dems and Repubs like her. She is trash that belongs in trash can, not a stateswoman we ought to have in her position. Ingolfe is aiming there too.
-- Pete
 
zaitcev said:
Never heard about a 757, and don't want to read the pool of leftist spin at Snopes, but it's a fact that Pelosi was using AF jets like her own for years, and throwing temper tantrums whenever AF did not satisfy her whims (over not getting a Gulfstream, for example). There were also issues of chantage over money allocation for Pentagon if they did not give her the biggest VIP plane. It was nasty, absolutely unacceptable behaviour of a typical Washington insider in power. We now have Tea Party just to purge Dems and Repubs like her. She is trash that belongs in trash can, not a stateswoman we ought to have in her position. Ingolfe is aiming there too.
-- Pete
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Easy tiger. Save that rant for SpinZone. You're in Hangar Talk at the moment.:cheerswine:
 
Ted DuPuis said:
If you don't tell anyone and you're at a non-towered airport that's not busy, nobody will likely know the difference.
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I agree. Last year, 5/23 was NOTAMed closed at Winder. Odd though, that the first day of the closure was a Saturday. I find it hard to believe any governmental work would go on then, but I digress.

This same Saturday was also the date of our monthly area lunch fly in. I was so tempted not to check info for just a 15 minute flight over there, but it's my responsibility to do so, and I was glad I did.

When I got there, no obvious activity was happening on the closed runway. 31 was still open, so I used that, but the wind was right down 23. During lunch, I saw no fewer than five bozos land on 23!
 
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One question I did not see addressed in the article:

Did Inhofe take the hotel courtesy car when he got there? :rofl:
 
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