After long flight hiatus --

[Tom Veatch]

In an attempt to avoid hijack of the thread containing this post:
http://www.pilotsofamerica.com/forum/showpost.php?p=616651&postcount=42

The instructor is deemed to be PIC in a training situation like this, and has the authority to make the final decisions. ...

The way I'm reading it: OP has a PP cert., therefore isn't a student pilot, but due to the "long hiatus", OP doesn't have a current BFR and cannot legally act as PIC. Hence the instructor is deemed to be PIC.

If that's a correct reading, what would be the situation if the OP met recent currency requirements, had a current BFR, and could legally act as PIC with passengers aboard? When flying under those conditions with an instructor aboard, i.e., instrument/commercial training, BFR renewal, refresher training, etc., would the instructor be automatically deemed to be PIC?

The circumstances interest me since I'm a PP/IR coming off a 30 year hiatus. For whatever it's worth, grandfathered for the complex/high performance/taildragger endorsements, and if I could find the documentation of my high altitude/pressure chamber training, might could grandfather that as well.

Within the last couple of days I received a 3rd Class Medical SI and as soon as it can be arranged, will be flying with an instructor. No question about the instructor being PIC in my case. About the only difference between me and a zero time student is I think I remember which end of the airplane goes first. (The end with that whirly-gig thing on it, right?)

The biggest changes since my last log entry in 1980 seem to be the change to ICAO airspace designations, GPS navigation, and, for good or evil, the influences of the patriot act, homeland security department, and the transportation security administration.

I've been doing some on-line study since starting the SI Medical process this past April; including most of the AOPA on-line, interactive courses and the "free" portions of all the on-line ground schools I've found. I'd be pleased to hear any other advice/recommendations that any of you might have.

 

[dillardrg]

If that's a correct reading, what would be the situation if the OP met recent currency requirements, had a current BFR, and could legally act as PIC with passengers aboard? When flying under those conditions with an instructor aboard, i.e., instrument/commercial training, BFR renewal, refresher training, etc., would the instructor be automatically deemed to be PIC?

Tom,

In that situation a preflight briefing should include who was to be PIC for the flight.
That having been said, if something were to happen during the flight that results in enough damage to the A/C to get the FAA involved they would most likely deem the instructor as PIC. I am not sure what the insurance company would decide.

Welcome back to flying.

 

[bbchien]

PIC will be whomever you agree to be, at the preflight, provided you have all the currencies and are not wearing foggles.

Congratulations on the SI, Tom. My single best recommendation for updating book knowledge is to take the Jeppesen CFI refresher course as a non CFI (it usually books out with the non-CFI discount to about $100). They're very good.

 

[wabower]

Is this a thread hijack from the red board?

 

[Tom Veatch]

Is this a thread hijack from the red board?

Not that I'm aware of, nor was such intended.

In the POA thread referenced in Post #1, mention was made of a situation in which a CFI would be presumed to be PIC. It piqued my interest and I wondered what would be the presumption under the different circumstances I described.

The consensus, so far, seems to be that PIC authority would be mutually decided prior to flight. Of course, that leaves the question open in the case of the flight terminating in a smoking hole in the ground if no record of the decision survived. Although in that case, I suspect the "left seat rule" would come into play.

 

[Tom Veatch]

Thanks Bruce. It's been a long process and very frustrating. Hopefully I've learned something and it will be faster and smoother in the future.

I still haven't received the letter. I'm basing my belief that the SI has been issued on the FAA's certification database showing a 3rd Class medical with a 04/10 date by my name. Up until yesterday, it simply said "Medical not available".

 

[rottydaddy]

Both can log PIC, but who is "acting" PIC must be agreed on beforehand. But of course, if something (reportable) goes wrong, whoever holds the highest rating winds up in the hot seat.