Admission To Hospital Question

Frankmarsh5 said:
what if I was at home, with the same BAC and someone broke into my home and did the same thing? Would you blame me for that as well?
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I don't blame you, but that mistake you made a long time ago may haunt you. This ship has already sailed for you. I'd stop arguing it here, in fact, I wouldn't have come here in the first place and told your tale, because a large audience now knows your story, including maybe some who officially look into this stuff. Hopefully not the case. But I would consider deleting your posts on this. I'm pretty sure that there aren't many pilots who have been stabbed in the stomach, then robbed.

Then I would apply for your medical when the time comes. List the hospitalization, give a brief summary along with the medical info. For the summary be brief, but concise, something like " I was waiting on a corner for a taxi after meeting some friends in the city. Some miscreant approached me from behind, stabbed me in the stomach several times before I could even lift a finger, then robbed me." If the guy was caught, include that info. Don't talk about where you were, or alcohol at all. Apply and be done with it, provide a note from your doc that you are fully recovered and have no deficits.

Hopefully you will just be issued. I wouldn't give any more detail than the bare minimum. If they come looking, then you'll have to deal with it. The previous dui is the big issue for you in that case.

Unrelated to your medical, something to keep in mind is some people unwittingly project a " hey, I'm an easy victim" appearance. These people are clueless about their surroundings, usually with ear buds blasting, face buried into their phones, oblivious to people around them. If this is you, you need to change that. Don't be an easy victim, pull the ear buds out, put the phone away and stay aware of your surroundings. People pondering doing you harm are usually easy to spot. They don't like it when their victim sees them coming and usually will move on to another victim, easier victim. If the criminal is bent on doing you harm, at least you are aware and have a much better chance of defending yourself. I don't know if this was you, but think about it.
 
I appreciate the responses. I’m going to rethink my life choices and make better decisions.

Since I was doing this ‘anonymously’, could the mods delete this thread?
 
dmspilot said:
Not to single you out since there are several posts saying this, but this is too much like blaming a rape victim for wearing revealing clothing. Patently absurd.
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Your analogy is quite flawed and seasoned in a way that would make any reply appear toxic. Good move. :rolleyes:
 
It’s ok to stumble around in public so drunk most people would be able to barely walk let alone defend themselves. If something bad happens you’re not responsible and won’t have to live with the consequences.
 
ThatOtherGuy said:
3. You got stabbed leaving a bar with a .163 BAC going to an Uber. You had to order the Uber because you went to the bar with the intent of getting too drunk to drive.
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This may be the most absurd statement in this whole thread. I take an Uber whenever I go to a bar with an intention of drinking because any amount of intoxication is too much to drive. So I guess if I get robbed next time I take an uber, I should just turn in my certificate. :confused:
 
Lindberg said:
This may be the most absurd statement in this whole thread. I take an Uber whenever I go to a bar with an intention of drinking because any amount of intoxication is too much to drive. So I guess if I get robbed next time I take an uber, I should just turn in my certificate. :confused:
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Do you do that with a previous DUI and after receiving a letter from the FAA that tells you any other alcohol related event will result in you being unable to earn a living in the career of your choice? Are you a professional pilot that has been warned by the federal agency that effectively holds your paycheck ransom?

Defend it all you want, it doesn't change reality. No one said all pilots should never drink. What was said is that pilots with a problematic history with alcohol should get it under control if they want to keep flying. Like it or not, that's the world we live in. If you want to complain feel free to write your congressperson or call the FAA.

The issue isn't getting robbed, whether the OP is a victim, this ridiculous counter attack of "victim shaming/blaming", or some contrived example of what if Martians shot me with their ray-guns while I was orbiting Venus with a beer in my hand. The issue is the DUI history, documented high BAC in public after significant negative consequence, the fact that the OP is a professional pilot, and that they were previously warned in writing by a federal agency that effectively controlled their livelihood.

Spend a few years in a room listening to people sing this same sad song about how booze ruined their lives or everyone is out to get them, and I guarantee that you'll see this differently.

You might not have a problem with alcohol, but telling people that do have a problem with alcohol that they're normal and it's not an issue is is a terrible thing to do to another human being.
 
IMHO, taking an Uber after drinking is a very responsible thing to do and should be applauded, not condemned.

Getting stabbed sucks, but does not reflect badly on the Stucky.

Agree though, the FAA has lost its collective minds.
 
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ThatOtherGuy said:
Do you do that with a previous DUI and after receiving a letter from the FAA that tells you any other alcohol related event will result in you being unable to earn a living in the career of your choice?
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I do it so I don't get a DUI, and so did the OP. Perhaps you're unaware that millions of drunk people ride in Ubers every week, specifically to avoid driving drunk. It's a responsible thing to do. It's also a decision usually made in advance--if you Uber to the bar, you're ubering home, so most people do it to be on the safe side. Your post implied that taking an Uber is something only malefactors do.

I drank last night. Probably had a BAC over .08; was definitely impaired. I didn't drive. Should I report it on my next medical? :(
 
So if the OP happened to be a pax in the Uber and the Uber happened to crash causing him hospitalization, would that be considered an alcohol event?

You got military pilots who have been getting **** faced in foreign countries since the beginning of military aviation. If the DOD had the same lack of tolerance that the FAA has, half their pilots would be grounded.
 
Velocity173 said:
So if the OP happened to be a pax in the Uber and the Uber happened to crash causing him hospitalization, would that be considered an alcohol event?

You got military pilots who have been getting **** faced in foreign countries since the beginning of military aviation. If the DOD had the same lack of tolerance that the FAA has, half their pilots would be grounded.
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It’s the same in the civilian pilot group. Most of us are smart enough not to report the crap. Only statists agree with these policies.

edit: let’s see how long it takes some statist to deride me. Bet I don’t have to wait long.
 
Frankmarsh5 said:
Im done drinking. Your comment of actions have consequences offends me though. I get if others are in danger such as driving. But does being intoxicated give someone the right to stab me?
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Nope. But FAA’s view is “this is about you and not the guy with the knife”....
 
BladeSlap said:
Wow, I'm just getting started, but if I ever get stabbed I will just break out super glue like my dad used on his hog hunting dogs.

I don't think .13 is that much, in college a friend at a party had one of those blow things,.08 isn't even drunk, I'm sure in milliseconds it can be noticeable, but for normal things it wasn't much, I'd bet most who drink, especially who know they don't have to drive easily get around the top figure.

This guy is a victim and many here are blaming him :(
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0.08 if not drug means “tolerance” meaning the only way to get there is to have been drinking long, and hard over time. FAA “ gets that”.
 
Daleandee said:
Had you been home, sober, aware of the danger of your surroundings, or legally prepared to protect/defend yourself the outcome most likely would have had a different result.
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It's your opinion he should have been ready to engage with the armed attacker? Does "legally prepared" mean the OP should have had a firearm in his possession and have been ready to shoot someone after he had illegally carried it into an establishment selling alcohol? That's an outright incredibly stupid comment. The "different result" would likely have been the OP laying on a sidewalk dead from multiple stab wounds instead of one.

This and other comments like it are ridiculous. Are pilots supposed to shut themselves indoors at all other times except flying to prevent a criminal attack on themselves? How does the FAA insert their enforcement into an event that has no connection whatsoever with flying or a motor vehicle and the OP had done nothing which falls under the reporting requirements of the medical application for an alcohol event?

Yes, the pilot had a DUI fifteen years ago. But he has also satisfied all reporting requirements and has been incident free since then. Why should he report something that he has no legal requirement to do so? What gives the FAA the right to become involved in a situation where the OP was doing nothing illegal, which had no connection whatsoever to his certificates and employment and was the victim of a crime?

Some of you flying around in your clapped out spam cans exhibit incredible self righteous opinions and a willingness to allow the government to run roughshod over someone else's life and livelihood. I suspect your perspective would be different if you were the person who was attacked and barely escaped death when standing on a street corner.
 
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PaulS said:
Unrelated to your medical, something to keep in mind is some people unwittingly project a " hey, I'm an easy victim" appearance. These people are clueless about their surroundings, usually with ear buds blasting, face buried into their phones, oblivious to people around them. If this is you, you need to change that. Don't be an easy victim, pull the ear buds out, put the phone away and stay aware of your surroundings. People pondering doing you harm are usually easy to spot. They don't like it when their victim sees them coming and usually will move on to another victim, easier victim. If the criminal is bent on doing you harm, at least you are aware and have a much better chance of defending yourself. I don't know if this was you, but think about it.
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More unbelievably outrageous and nonsensical commentary. Another poster that criticizes the OP for not foreseeing he was going to be attacked by someone using deadly force and not trying to defend himself.

What experience and training makes you think it's a good idea for the average person to engage with an armed attacker?

Does it occur to you that perhaps the reason the OP is still alive is because he didn't offer resistance? Are you suggesting that if the same thing happened to you, you would have fought with the armed attacker? Life isn't like television or the movies. The OP could easily have died.
 
bbchien said:
0.08 if not drug means “tolerance” meaning the only way to get there is to have been drinking long, and hard over time. FAA “ gets that”.
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Where did the 0.08 number come from?
 
AggieMike88 said:
We are trying to provide straight advice based on many of us seeing many many threads like this and listening to what our esteemed AME’s in residence, Dr. Bruce and Dr. Lou have said in response.

That you are deflecting and defending because you’re not being told what you desire to hear makes me think you’re headed toward at best being stuck into an expensive medical penalty box, and at worst, medical revoked.

Paraphrasing Dr. Bruce, “You either get it, or you don’t”
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You repeatedly admit you have no authority to offer an opinion about this situation, but that hasn't prevented you from making more than one post doing just that.

Do point out where, in the long history of the medical topics forum, there have been "many, many threads" where a poster has been the victim of a criminal attack while standing on a street corner intoxicated.

You have also accused the OP of engaging in the common tactic of an alcohol abuser to "defend and deflect". Painting the OP with that odious brush is improper and unfounded. That has not a damn thing to do with his situation and legal consumption of alcohol.

The same applies to your quote of Dr Chien. The good doctor uses that phrase when dealing with someone who has run afoul of the FAA because he denies he has an alcohol abuse issue. That is not the case here.
 
Daleandee said:
Your analogy is quite flawed and seasoned in a way that would make any reply appear toxic. Good move. :rolleyes:
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3393RP said:
It's your opinion he should have been ready to engage with the armed attacker? Does "legally prepared" mean the OP should have had a firearm in his possession and have been ready to shoot someone after he had illegally carried it into an establishment selling alcohol? That's an outright incredibly stupid comment.
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The incredibly stupid comment is yours as you seem to have a reading comprehension disability. You quoted and I said "legally prepared" which of course would mean that you do not carry a weapon if you're under the influence of alcohol or visiting establishments where the carrying of a firearm is unlawful.

I'm not blaming the victim but pointing out that better choices often times give better results. If you must drink then consider a better section of town, take a friend as there's safety in numbers, maybe even a bit of pepper spray in your pocket (I'm not a fan of this method). In the world we live in you had better be ready to physically defend yourself at all times. It's a dangerous world out there. Not putting yourself in harm's way, and being prepared for when it comes is what I'm suggesting. You should take a moment to comprehend what is written before you start accusing someone of making an "outright incredibly stupid comment."
 
I'm with Bruce on this. The OP made his choice. Should probably find a new line of work. Maybe he'll get by this one (I doubt it), but he'll get tripped up in the end.
 
The OP was in a nice part of town. He’s at a “special occasion” so I take it he wasn’t alone. Has the presence of mind to take a cab. Not a whole lot of risk there. The outcome was jus bad luck, not poor decision making.

He could have just as easily had a get together at home and drank with friends. He answers the doorbell and gets stabbed by stranger trying to rob him. I guess that’s an alcohol event?:confused:
 
Everyone else has weighed in, I guess I will too. I see two issues here:

1. From a medical certification standpoint, this is not a reportable event for questions 18v or 18w. It just needs to be reported in 18u under admission to hospital. Note the following:

"For each admission, the applicant should list the dates, diagnoses, duration, treatment, name of the attending physician, and complete address of the hospital or clinic. If previously reported, the applicant may enter "PREVIOUSLY REPORTED, NO CHANGE." A history of hospitalization does not disqualify an applicant, although the medical condition that resulted in hospitalization may."

Accordingly, based on the reason for the visit, there is likely no reason for the FAA to ask for further information than what is specified above. This event is highly unlikely to initiate a HIMS protocol.

2. There's lots of pearl clutching on this thread, but there is some substance to their point. Going out and having a few drinks is one thing. Getting a-faced drunk is another. Even when you arrange a DD or Uber for transportation, unexpected things can happen when you get very inebriated. There's a reason the "hold my beer" meme exists. I'm going to stop short of accusing you of being responsible for your attack...you didn't deserve it, regardless of how drunk you were, how rich you were, how attractive you were, or how skimpily you were dressed.

That said, when you drink to get drunk, you're spinning the wheel of consequences. 99 times you'll experience a Miller beer commercial. That other 1% will result in loud arguments, fists through glsss windows, tripping on stairs, etc. Some of those events will involve visits to the ER. Don't put your livelihood at risk.

If you're going to drink, drink in moderation. If you can't drink in moderation, don't drink.

It sounds like the OP has chosen the latter, so there's not much more to say...
 
“How does the FAA insert their enforcement into an event that has no connection whatsoever with flying or a motor vehicle and the OP had done nothing which falls under the reporting requirements of the medical application for an alcohol event?”

They do it by snooping through your records.

They insert their enforcement by saying it’s in the name of safety...

It’s ok to violate an individual’s rights if you it’s for the good of society.

Now, I think it’s a bunch of crap, but if you’re still wondering how, that’s how...
 
The holier-than-you replies are unfortunate. Stuff happens unfortunately and suggesting the OP finds a new line of work is ridiculous and narrow minded. I'm sure EVERYONE here has been in a situation where they could have been stabbed by some lunatic. Think about that for a second.
 
Tools said:
“How does the FAA insert their enforcement into an event that has no connection whatsoever with flying or a motor vehicle and the OP had done nothing which falls under the reporting requirements of the medical application for an alcohol event?”

They do it by snooping through your records.

They insert their enforcement by saying it’s in the name of safety...

It’s ok to violate an individual’s rights if you it’s for the good of society.

Now, I think it’s a bunch of crap, but if you’re still wondering how, that’s how...
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I'm pretty sure the FAA cannot randomly 'snoop' through records without some type of court order and cause for suspicion (i.e. accident).
 
The OP said the BAC was one line of a million lines. So it’s there. It may not be relevant, but it’s there.

So if the OP submits EVERYTHING he stands a chance of that being used against him.

Whether he can cull that out, or something, seems the sort of thing a lawyer would be qualified to help with.
 
There’s drinking and then there’s drinking in public to a BAC of .163. Two very different things.
 
Salty said:
There’s drinking and then there’s drinking in public to a BAC of .163. Two very different things.
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Is drinking at home to a BAC of .163 any different? What if he was mugged at home or at a friends party??
 
Tools said:
The OP said the BAC was one line of a million lines. So it’s there. It may not be relevant, but it’s there.

So if the OP submits EVERYTHING he stands a chance of that being used against him.

Whether he can cull that out, or something, seems the sort of thing a lawyer would be qualified to help with.
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If the OP was smart, he wouldn't include any records that mention his BAC or mention what he was doing at the time (it's not their business).
 
Tools said:
The OP said the BAC was one line of a million lines. So it’s there. It may not be relevant, but it’s there.

So if the OP submits EVERYTHING he stands a chance of that being used against him.

Whether he can cull that out, or something, seems the sort of thing a lawyer would be qualified to help with.
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Im not sure why he would need to submit his lab work, considering the AME guidance asks for "dates, diagnoses, duration, treatment, name of the attending physician, and complete address of the hospital or clinic", unless intoxication was a diagnosis.
 
Brad Z said:
Im not sure why he would need to submit his lab work, considering the AME guidance asks for "dates, diagnoses, duration, treatment, name of the attending physician, and complete address of the hospital or clinic", unless intoxication was a diagnosis.
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He doesn't- people are talking out of their arse. I was admitted to the hospital a few years ago for 3.5 weeks. They draw blood daily- there was literally 300+ lab reports. Good luck trying to collect and shift through all of that. All I submitted was the hospital admission form and discharge form. Nothing more, nothing less. Anything can bury you.

For example, there was a note in one of my daily notes "patient became agitated after waking up from anesthesia, diazepam was oked (I never took it). Theres NO way I would submit that note to the FAA. It was irrelevant to why I was there but a normal side effect. The FAA could've used that against me though. "Airman show signs of anxiety..." See where I'm going with that?
 
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mole hill.....become mountain. Just fill out the form and provide the needed information. No more....no less.
 
3393RP said:
More unbelievably outrageous and nonsensical commentary. Another poster that criticizes the OP for not foreseeing he was going to be attacked by someone using deadly force and not trying to defend himself.

What experience and training makes you think it's a good idea for the average person to engage with an armed attacker?

Does it occur to you that perhaps the reason the OP is still alive is because he didn't offer resistance? Are you suggesting that if the same thing happened to you, you would have fought with the armed attacker? Life isn't like television or the movies. The OP could easily have died.
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Unbelievable, why don't you read the paragraph you quoted again, try to understand it, and then comment.

And just to be clear, I specifically said, that if this is you, meaning the OP, so I'm not accusing him or criticizing him of anything, he didn't object to that, so what ever he was doing, he was caught by surprise. He lived because he was lucky, not because he didn't resist, that guy didn't care if he lived or died, he tried to kill him.

But I'll tell you what "occurs" to me and why I wrote it. There are a lot of people who need to hear what I wrote, including apparently you.

The OP was surprised by this guy stabbing him, the first thing he noticed was a knife slipping into his gut. Unlike you, I can't imagine the OP would passively sit there while some guy, holding a knife no less, walks up to him. Why would anyone, except apparently you, stand there and wait to be stabbed? That's why it's important to notice people around you. Just be aware, not afraid, just notice things, you know, like some guy with a knife, looking at you, walking directly to you.

My first instinct would be to get the hell out of there, to see if I could run faster than the guy coming at me, holding a knife. If I'm faster, then great, I'm not stabbed. If it looks like the guy is going to catch me, then I fight. I don't care about "training", in my mind it would be me or him. You can sit there and get stabbed without resisting, I want to live.

"The OP could have easily died." Sounds like he almost did.

Oh, and it's not "foreseeing", it's looking and seeing what is going on around you. People respect personal space naturally. If someone you don't know is about to violate your personal space intentionally or unintentionally, your first defense is noticing it's about to happen, be ready for it, and act appropriately.

There are a million scenarios that could happen. If you are unaware, then you will be a victim if someone means you harm.
 
Do you think just maybe you’d have a better chance to avoid being stabbed if you didn’t have a BAC of .163?

I often disagree with Bruce’s attitude towards those with a DUI. I disagree with the faa’s approach as well.

But, I don’t like getting drunk because I want to be able to avoid a situation Ike this by my own control, and I think that’s much more likely if I’m not falling down drunk. Again, drinking is one thing. Drinking to a BAC of .163 is something else. You’ve given up a large amount of control of your personal situation when you’re that drunk.
 
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