Abandoning Garmin Pilot for Avare

sarangan

sarangan

Pattern Altitude
Joined
Jun 7, 2008
Messages
1,904
Display Name
Display name:
Andrew, CFI-I
After one year of using Garmin Pilot on Android, I am fed up. It is slow to start, sluggish and the menus are non-intuitive. Things like "Flight Plan" and "Trip plan". I never figured out what the difference was. Winds aloft shows 5 day old wind first, and you have to swipe 5 times to get to the forecast winds. Bugs don't get addressed quickly. Even the Garmin folks discouraged me from using their product - they said I should use their iOS version. So why are they marketing it if they don't consider it to be a market-worthy product? Good thing is, I have discovered Avare. I've flown with it for a little while, including IFR, and I was blown away by its performance. Crisp, super-fast, intuitive and great support from an open-source community. Garmin's excuse was that it was difficult to write efficient code for Android since there are so many flavors. So how does a group of unpaid volunteers do it better, faster and cheaper?

I thought I'd offer this unsolicited advice in case anyone is looking for alternatives to Garmin Pilot (or even Foreflight) ,
 
I couldn’t use the avare interface and I don’t have the issue on my android tablet but for free Avare is pretty decent.
 
Walboy said:
Are Avare charts and plates geo referenced?
Click to expand...

Yep.

I've been using it for years. Simple, fast, and not a lot of useless geegaws. Flight Planning is a little cumbersome until you get used to it. Works with portable ADS- b out to display wx and tfc. Works with my certified ads-b installation.

Highly recommend.
 
Walboy said:
Are Avare charts and plates geo referenced?
Click to expand...

Not only are they georeferenced, they can be overlaid on a sectional or enroute chart (Garmin has this feature too).
 
FltPlan Go is a good Android alternative as well, and flight planning works more gooder.
 
sarangan said:
After one year of using Garmin Pilot on Android, I am fed up. It is slow to start, sluggish and the menus are non-intuitive. Things like "Flight Plan" and "Trip plan". I never figured out what the difference was. Winds aloft shows 5 day old wind first, and you have to swipe 5 times to get to the forecast winds. Bugs don't get addressed quickly. Even the Garmin folks discouraged me from using their product - they said I should use their iOS version. So why are they marketing it if they don't consider it to be a market-worthy product? Good thing is, I have discovered Avare. I've flown with it for a little while, including IFR, and I was blown away by its performance. Crisp, super-fast, intuitive and great support from an open-source community. Garmin's excuse was that it was difficult to write efficient code for Android since there are so many flavors. So how does a group of unpaid volunteers do it better, faster and cheaper?

I thought I'd offer this unsolicited advice in case anyone is looking for alternatives to Garmin Pilot (or even Foreflight) ,
Click to expand...
I love Avare. But winds aloft seems to be perpetually broken too.

Love the free Geo referenced plates though. Also being free is nice
 
Actually I too assumed that the winds-aloft was broke, but it is not. You get the correct winds aloft, ground speed & heading etc if you put it in "simulate" mode. In a sense, "simulate" is the flight-planning mode. When you fly, put it in "navigate" mode. What might be confusing here is that the winds aloft go blank when you switch to "navigate". That's because when you are flying you are using your measured ground speed and heading, not predicted values. This makes sense to me in hind sight, but I was confused at first.
 
Chip Sylverne said:
Yep.

I've been using it for years. Simple, fast, and not a lot of useless geegaws. Flight Planning is a little cumbersome until you get used to it. Works with portable ADS- b out to display wx and tfc. Works with my certified ads-b installation.

Highly recommend.
Click to expand...

Been using Avare for years as well. As you said, the flight planning/user interface takes some getting used to, but you do learn it. I donate to them now and then even though it's not required to use full features.
 
IFly is my go-to for Android

Sent from my SM-T397U using Tapatalk
 
Droid EFB is simple to use and interfaces with all your ADS-B doodads. There are versions with or without georeferenced plates. I don't use georeferenced plates but it's there if you want it. Android only, and runs snappily even on legacy or low end tablets.

Cheers.
 
Last edited:
Indeed, iFly does Geo-Ref and the whole she-bang. Great vertical planning setup as well.
 
I've had avare on my phone for a while, but haven't used it in the air yet. It seems to work really well in the car though. To me the interface is not very intuitive, but I don't really need a lot out of it for they flying I do. For something to show you exactly where you are on the sectional or how far you are from your destination it seems perfect. I'm sure it can do a lot more but that's all I really need, and that's just for peace of mind/confirmation of what I should already know.
I was thinking about getting an iPad and foreflight, but for the price and for how I would use it I think I'll just stick with avare.
 
Another FltPlan Go user here. This post makes me wonder if Garmin purchased FltPlan Go to use instead of or rebrand as Garmin Pilot.
 
AdamZ said:
Another FltPlan Go user here. This post makes me wonder if Garmin purchased FltPlan Go to use instead of or rebrand as Garmin Pilot.
Click to expand...

I'm thinking FltPlanGO goes away at some point unfortunately. What Garmin wanted was to plug into the part 135 operators who use FltPlan heavily. FltPlanGo was just part of the portfolio but is probably expendable in their eyes as it really doesn't pair up with their mainline EFB product... Just my read of the tea leaves
 
I have been using Avare for a few years too. I am a VFR only pilot and I used a Bendix King Av8r as my primary GPS and Avare on a 5" Samsung Tablet as my backup. I like that the Android tablets have built in GPS, unlike the iPad Wifi models.

With my recent purchase of a Cherokee 140, I gained a Garmin aero 500 ( I purchased the updates too), so that will be my primary GPS and I will continue to use Avare as my backup, with my home built Stratux ADS-B In device.

Greg
 
Shoot, I must be the only one who doesn't like Avare. I have Foreflight on my iPad for flying and wanted something on my phone too so downloaded Avare.. it feels extremely "free" and "home made" - and maybe I'm too embedded in the Foreflight ecosystem but this does not feel intuitive at all

Maybe I'll try iFly or something else if there are recommendations from the collective here
 
I only use Avare to get a bigger display for weather and airport diagrams since the Android tablet is a bigger screen. I don't use it for flight planning at all other than --D-> to whatever my next way point is.

It does give approximate times of the sports TFRs though, which is nice.
 
Tantalum said:
Shoot, I must be the only one who doesn't like Avare. I have Foreflight on my iPad for flying and wanted something on my phone too so downloaded Avare.. it feels extremely "free" and "home made" - and maybe I'm too embedded in the Foreflight ecosystem but this does not feel intuitive at all

Maybe I'll try iFly or something else if there are recommendations from the collective here
Click to expand...
You are not alone...
 
Avare's interface is a bit, ah, odd. After you use it for awhile it starts to make sense. But it's more than adequate for my needs (low and slow day VFR), so I've never used any other EFB.
 
Dana said:
Avare's interface is a bit, ah, odd. After you use it for awhile it starts to make sense. But it's more than adequate for my needs (low and slow day VFR), so I've never used any other EFB.
Click to expand...

Actually, it is not odd, but different. At a fundamental level, it is actually more logical and simpler than other software. However, it will take a few flights to become comfortable. On the other hand, I never figured out the logic behind Garmin Pilot's interface even after a long time of use. Also, I don't feel it is a VFR-only tool. I've flown hard IFR with it, and actually feel a lot more comfortable with Avare than Garmin Pilot.
 
What tablets are you guys using to run avare? It probably doesn't take much since my 4+ year old phone seems to run it just fine, but I'm thinking about picking up a tablet in the $100 or so price range for avare.

Also, do you have to have a data plan to use it on a tablet, or can you just download the maps and plates you need at home on your Wi-Fi then you're good to go?
 
Last edited:
M1tchell said:
What tablets are you guys using to run avare? It probably doesn't take much since my 4+ year old phone seems to run it just fine, but I'm thinking about picking up a tablet in the $100 or so price range for avare.

Also, do you have to have a data plan to use it on a tablet, or can you just download the maps and plates you need at home on your Wi-Fi then you're good to go?
Click to expand...

Have an ASUS Zenpad10. I load it on wifi, but I do have unlimited data as well. Wifi seems faster to download.
 
Right, but once everything is downloaded, would the app function if you don't have a data plan on your tablet? Or does it require internet to run?
 
M1tchell said:
Right, but once everything is downloaded, would the app function if you don't have a data plan on your tablet? Or does it require internet to run?
Click to expand...
Nope. Internet (WiFi or LTE) only needed for downloads, briefings and filing. Once in the air, Internet isn't needed any more.

And you don't need a data plan. WiFi is enough.

And I run it on a 6 year old Nexus 7. I also have a 1.5 year old Lenovo Tab 4 Plus for backup.
 
I run Avare on a new phone (Pixel 3) and old tablet (7" Nvidia Shield K1).
 
M1tchell said:
What tablets are you guys using to run avare? It probably doesn't take much since my 4+ year old phone seems to run it just fine, but I'm thinking about picking up a tablet in the $100 or so price range for avare.

Also, do you have to have a data plan to use it on a tablet, or can you just download the maps and plates you need at home on your Wi-Fi then you're good to go?
Click to expand...
I'm using a free old sprint Samsung tablet , only use it for vfr. Never need anything thing else - except sectional, compass and watch just in case.
 
Walboy said:
I just watched Avare's intro video on Youtube. I'm not sure how to describe it...quirky? Wow.

The sound of crashing waves at the beach is a nice touch.

Click to expand...
That video is 2 years old.
 
Walboy said:
I followed the Youtube link on Avare's website so I assumed it's the one they want you to view.
Click to expand...
That's one of the unfortunate aspects of free open source software from volunteers. Some parts of the project get ignored/abandoned and documentation is often one of the first to fall behind because for most people it is much less exciting/interesting than banging out code.
 
Samsung Tab 3. 8gb plus a 15gb mini SD card for the files. Runs fine, battery life is an issue, but I have a charger in the airplane.
 
M1tchell said:
Right, but once everything is downloaded, would the app function if you don't have a data plan on your tablet? Or does it require internet to run?
Click to expand...

I run Avare on a 2-year-old Samsung Galaxy Tab A, wifi only. Works great, cost $179 when new. Just download everything at home or McDonald's (which I've done driving to get google maps to work on it's screen [much larger than my phone]).
 
I swam upstream for a few years with an Android product called Naviator. It got to be ok after a lengthy period of crashes, poor performance and low functionality. The builder decided to go off to other things and development came to a screeching halt and I then reluctantly switched over to Foreflight "succumbing" to the Apple technology after a search for Android alternatives. It turns out that's the best thing I ever did. Foreflight has had some issues, most recently with the obsolescence of older iPads that can run it. However, it is a MUCH better product than what I have seen running on Android. At $200 per year its also pretty affordable saving me money on maps and keeping me up to date. There are offsetting costs like more expensive equipment (Apple). Those picking up their crosses rather than their wings will stick to the Android "open source" ideology but for my money (and flying) its just not worth it, particularly if you fly IFR.
 
I haven't messed with the $200/year Foreflight or Garmin Pilot (other than a trial demo) but AVARE has everything I need. It's kind of like my HP 48GX calculator from college; different but once you are used to it everything else seems slow and clunky in comparison. AVARE is much quicker and more stable than anything else I have tried and once you download the data it works great without a GPS connection. I just wish Garmin would let it interface with the GTX345.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top