6 people presumed dead after helicopter crashes in California's Mojave Desert en route to Las Vegas area

AP story says rain and snow at that time, according to California Highway Patrol.
 
Most likely an another helicopter CFIT accident. He was flying along I15 in bad weather (rain/snow mix) and the terrain starts getting mountainous in the Halloran Springs area. Some peaks very close to the highway of 4200ft in that area. Last reported altitude was 4400 ft. Sad.
 
jmolli said:
Most likely an another helicopter CFIT accident.
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Or he simply had an engine failure and botched the autorotation. Will be interesting if the aircraft had an inlet filter system installed as flying in falling or blowing snow is prohibited for this model without one.
 
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Bell206 said:
Or he simply had an engine failure and botched the autorotation. Will be interesting if the aircraft had an inlet filter system installed as flying in falling or blowing snow is prohibited for this model without one.
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There was no sign of a decrease in airspeed, up to the last ADSB data point it was stable at around 167-170 kts. I also just noticed that FlightAware now shows the last reported altitude as 3800ft and a -226 fpm rate of decent (although its quite possible his ADSB Out transmissions were blocked by terrain after that data point, as the crash location looks to be a quite a bit further up I15 from the last ADSB data point location). Peaks in the vicinity of the crash are marked at 4200ft. I'm guessing he descended to maintain a visual on the highway as the ceiling was coming down with the weather. Its just a shame that six people were lost. Prayers to the families involved.
 
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Video in post #11 says this was a T2 but registration info says it was an older B4. Assume the desire to stay VFR drove the decision to fly I-15 (~250 nm) vs go direct (~150 nm). Seems to me there were charter options better suited to the mission profile but perhaps this close to the SB this charter helo is all that was available.
 
It’s not even that much of a drive. Leave after breakfast and they’d be in Vegas for lunch.
 
Second and final briefing by NTSB noted flight track data showed the accident helicopter traveling 1,000 - 1,500 AGL during flight along I-15. Near the end of the flight track data (ended ~1/4 mi from impact with terrain), helicopter turned slightly to right to the S of I-15, with a gradual descent and increasing groundspeed. In the first NTSB briefing, crew identified as a PIC and a safety pilot.

Inadvertent or unsuccessful VMC to IMC transition?
 
AquaLand said:
Second and final briefing by NTSB noted flight track data showed the accident helicopter traveling 1,000 - 1,500 AGL during flight along I-15. Near the end of the flight track data (ended ~1/4 mi from impact with terrain), helicopter turned slightly to right to the S of I-15, with a gradual descent and increasing groundspeed. In the first NTSB briefing, crew identified as a PIC and a safety pilot.

Inadvertent or unsuccessful VMC to IMC transition?
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Transition to IMC as in intentionally doing that? This was a VFR equipped helicopter. Not that it’s impossible to fly under IFR from a safety standpoint. Just not legal. Not to mention the icing would’ve done them in.

I think this is typical Kobe Bryant scenario. Even following a road leading up to higher terrain. At some point when you’re approaching that crest, you realize the other side is nothing but white. Do a 180 and live to fly another day.
 
Velocity173 said:
Transition to IMC as in intentionally doing that? This was a VFR equipped helicopter. Not that it’s impossible to fly under IFR from a safety standpoint. Just not legal. Not to mention the icing would’ve done them in.

I think this is typical Kobe Bryant scenario. Even following a road leading up to higher terrain. At some point when you’re approaching that crest, you realize the other side is nothing but white. Do a 180 and live to fly another day.
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Even worse scud running at night in a sparsely populated area. You can't see how much you can't see.
 
midwestpa24 said:
Even worse scud running at night in a sparsely populated area. You can't see how much you can't see.
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Man, for some reason I was thinking this was daylight. Yeah that’s absolutely insane to being doing this route at night. No idea if this charter operator uses NVGs. Would’ve definitely helped but I think like what happened with the CH-53 accident, they’re not a magic turn the night into day tool. Because they can see through thin obscuration, they can lull you into believing the weather is better than it really is. Wires are extremely hard to see at night as well.

aerossurance.com

Air Ambulance Night Wirestrike at Poorly Chosen Landing Site - Aerossurance

A Fire Dept set up a landing site at night under the edge of powerlines. The HEMS pilot looked for the wires using NVGs but could only see the towers.
aerossurance.com aerossurance.com
 
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As crazy as it seems, I think they were using headlights visible on I-15 for navigation. The helicopter took off from PSP and followed interstates from that point until the crash occurred.
 
3393RP said:
As crazy as it seems, I think they were using headlights visible on I-15 for navigation. The helicopter took off from PSP and followed interstates from that point until the crash occurred.
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I was actually following a road in Kosovo onetime at night under similar circumstances. Dark, mountainous, ceilings pushing us down with rain / snow mix. We rounded the bend and got blinded under NVGs from the headlights from a car. Few seconds later one of my crew chiefs “sir, we need to go home now.” We did.
 
Vance Breese said:
The accident was at 21:50Z and sunset at nearby Baker is at 01:23Z.
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The NTSB briefing reported times in Pacific Standard Time (PST). The accident aircraft departed Palm Springs at 20:45 PST and impacted terrain at 22:08 PST.
 
Are commercial helo pilots without IFR ratings a common thing? Filing is so easy. Do not understand.
 
Hengelo said:
Are commercial helo pilots without IFR ratings a common thing? Filing is so easy. Do not understand.
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The helicopter has to be equipped and certified for IFR flight, and that would include an autopilot. The pilot would have to be instrument rated and trained on the helicopter. Since this was a Part 135 flight, the operator would also have to be certified for IFR Operations (OpSpecs, Training, Checking)

So not as easy as just filing.
 
Lots of VFR only helicopter operators with just enough in the panel to get you home if you enter IMC by accident…flying IFR for most operators is not common even if equipped in my experience.
 
What I meant was if the bird is equipped and the pilot rated, so easy to just file.
 
Hengelo said:
What I meant was if the bird is equipped and the pilot rated, so easy to just file.
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FYI: With a few exceptions, all single engine helicopters are not IFR capable. And in the twin-engine category more helicopters require two pilots to fly IFR than just a single properly rated pilot.
 
That all makes sense. Appreciate the lesson(s). Didn't think I could more wary of them, but I am now. **** you Arnold, how about No?

Bell206 said:
FYI: With a few exceptions, all single engine helicopters are not IFR capable. And in the twin-engine category more helicopters require two pilots to fly IFR than just a single properly rated pilot.
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Whatevs. They're going into the same brain space as spiders. Ain't right.

Bell206 said:
No need to be. Thousands of helicopter flights happen every day with zero issues. With many more than airplanes that fall to the same result. Stupid is as stupid does regardless of aircraft type. ;)
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Helicopters demand respect and discipline. Their unstable nature doesn't tolerate a lax attitude, especially in the smaller machines with no stability augmentation.
 
AV8R_87 said:
Helicopters demand respect and discipline. Their unstable nature doesn't tolerate a lax attitude, especially in the smaller machines with no stability augmentation.
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That's exactly what they say about spiders.
 
Bell206 said:
There are supposedly public reports of downed wires in the same area of the accident. So much for having a 2nd pilot onboard to prevent these types of things.
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At somewhat over 150 kts, without perfect visibility, you'd only know if there were wires if you hit them.
 
Yeah you would never see the wires at night only the power poles until as suggested you hit them…
 
I see wires along the road on the sectional but satellite doesn’t show anything around the accident site. Some high tension wires cross I15 about 5 miles prior to the site.
 
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