PRE Buy Inspection
- Thread starter dnbshp
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Gary Ward
En-Route
My suggestion is to pick a AP that will do your MX work on it also.
bonefishpete
Pre-takeoff checklist
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Bonefishpete
This plus if I ever buy another plane I'm skipping the pre buy and having an annual preformed. That is a cursory pre buy then if looks good straight to an annual. Got stuck on a plane once that I had a pre buy inspection done then later an annual that exposed stuff that the pre buy missed.
FPK1
Line Up and Wait
Ben's at KFUL 714-396-6090
He is just a few miles east of Hawthorne. Like all of them, he is pretty busy though...
He is just a few miles east of Hawthorne. Like all of them, he is pretty busy though...
pfarber
Line Up and Wait
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pfarber
so you're gonna pay for an annual when an annual wouldn't be legally required to check for the things a pre - buy would?
you could put it as a contingency but who pays if you walk away? Could the previous owner count that?
just wanting to understand your thought process and why an owner would allow you to tear up his AC and maybe cost $$$ to fix the descripencies.
bonefishpete
Pre-takeoff checklist
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Bonefishpete
well my pre buy didn't catch what an annual would. Maybe you can say I had a poor pre buy? But a pre buy at least mine doesn't inspect the plane like an annual does. Do a pre buy inspection then if it passes roll it into a annual. If a annual turns up discrepancies then decide on a purchase or walk away. All paid by the buyer.
My case the pre buy didn't discover leaking fuel lines and old rock hard bladder tank connections simply because the headliner wasn't removed. Didn't catch corroded trim cables and other problems. Very possibly I had a poor pre buy but most pre buys don't inspect the plane like an annual does otherwise they'd cost as much as a annual does.
What I'm saying is my pre buy the plane wasn't "open up" like a normal annual does. The headliner wasn't removed like a normal annual. The gasolater wasn't opened and inspected (corroded). Not all the inspection covers removed, some were some weren't. More a cursory inspection.
Just saying for me it's money well spent even if you walk away.
I've used Owen Poirier, Barefoot Aviation, on two pre-buys. He performs pre-buys exclusively and travels to the location of the aircraft. He saved me quite a bit by avoiding a purchase on one C210 and finding a few items on the one I purchased that, the cost to repair, was factored in to the final purchase price. Excellent service, IME.
What airplane routinely requires the removal of the Headliner for an
Annual Inspection?
It should be noted it is up to the Buyer to dictate the scope of a Pre-Buy
to determine if it is a sound Financial Deal. Things like worn or faded
upholstery and runs in paint can be more expensive than an engine
overhaul.
A Buyer that tells the Tech to check “ whatever you think “ is foolish
and if the Tech accepts that the Financial Liability is huge. With an Annual
there is guidance for scope and detail. A “ simple “ thing like “ any
corrosion?” could entail scoping the interior of flight controls and other
in- depth checks.
Some items I’ve used for PB’s and the first Annual are the Airworthiness
Alerts and Inspection Aids. These go back a long ways and reflect
items found. Not all become AD’s or SB’s. I’ve thought about compiling
them by model but it is another daunting task.
My preference is to have the Buyer present and ask “what else do you
want me to check?”. The Buyer would do well to contact a Type Club
on this matter as well.
The Seller should determine what would happen if the deal falls apart
due to a finding. Will the Buyer pay to reassemble the aircraft ?
Assuring one area is addressed and closed before moving to the next
task can minimize this. I’ve seen Buyers walk out and refuse to pay the
Tech ; who also promptly departed!
Annual Inspection?
It should be noted it is up to the Buyer to dictate the scope of a Pre-Buy
to determine if it is a sound Financial Deal. Things like worn or faded
upholstery and runs in paint can be more expensive than an engine
overhaul.
A Buyer that tells the Tech to check “ whatever you think “ is foolish
and if the Tech accepts that the Financial Liability is huge. With an Annual
there is guidance for scope and detail. A “ simple “ thing like “ any
corrosion?” could entail scoping the interior of flight controls and other
in- depth checks.
Some items I’ve used for PB’s and the first Annual are the Airworthiness
Alerts and Inspection Aids. These go back a long ways and reflect
items found. Not all become AD’s or SB’s. I’ve thought about compiling
them by model but it is another daunting task.
My preference is to have the Buyer present and ask “what else do you
want me to check?”. The Buyer would do well to contact a Type Club
on this matter as well.
The Seller should determine what would happen if the deal falls apart
due to a finding. Will the Buyer pay to reassemble the aircraft ?
Assuring one area is addressed and closed before moving to the next
task can minimize this. I’ve seen Buyers walk out and refuse to pay the
Tech ; who also promptly departed!
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In my experience, its not the type of inspection but who is preforming it. If you have some 3rd party mechanic perform your prebuy or annual, there is no guarantee when you get that aircraft back home and have your mechanic or shop perform its next mx or annual that everything will be good either. What is considered airworthy is both objective and subjective to the person performing the work. And as to a seller allowing an annual to be performed as part of the prebuy without some sort of agreement or understanding with the buyer would not be the wisest thing to do and one I do not recommend unless you're in escrow or something as binding.